Spoilers - Reign Spoilers and Speculation #52: Mary is finally home in Scotland. What does Season 4 have in store for our three queens? - Page 5

**ds44** · 12-18-2016, 05:13 PM

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Originally Posted by hurricane eyes (View Post)

Ah

. So she just maimed him

.

I just looked him up on google and damn he was a hottie

. I mean wow. Why did she end up stabbing him? Also why (aside from his beautiful face) did she have an affair?

Sorry if I'm annoying, but last I saw this show Mary and Francis had gotten married and the hot king died.

Well she got raped and blamed Francis and started spending time with Conde. His dick apparently had magical healing powers but he got mad that she wouldn't help him oust Francis so they could be together.

scififan2009 · 12-18-2016, 05:53 PM

He also married Queen Elizabeth by proxy. There were a lot of people in support of him becoming the next king of England.

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Originally Posted by ds44 (View Post)

Well she got raped and blamed Francis and started spending time with Conde. His dick apparently had magical healing powers but he got mad that she wouldn't help him oust Francis so they could be together.

To be fair, Conde did also help Mary find the men responsible so she could kill them herself.

Stelena&Bamon · 12-18-2016, 06:05 PM

Yeah Mary and Conde started as a friendship while Francis was being stupid. Conde kept being the person she could turn to. Then he tracked down her attackers and rapist with her and killed them. She blamed Francis because it was his actions that led the attackers to coming to the castle.

It was such a messy season.

I disliked Frary for about 2 seasons so I didn't mind them going up in flames. The way Francis dealt with Narcisse and the whole situation was so annoying.

Sean Teale is hot! Adelaide Kane's acting was great! Bright side lol!

By the time Francis died they managed to pull the show together....somewhat and it made for a beautiful ending to their disastrous relationship.

scififan2009 · 12-18-2016, 06:22 PM

In Francis's defence, he was being blackmailed by Narcisse.

Unfortunately by the time he and Bash had eliminated the evidence the damage had already been done.

hurricane eyes · 12-18-2016, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ds44 (View Post)

Well she got raped and blamed Francis and started spending time with Conde. His dick apparently had magical healing powers but he got mad that she wouldn't help him oust Francis so they could be together.

Looking at his face I believe it

.

Seriously though just reading about that has me annoyed about the poor execution of a rape story line. Like if they wanted to cause drama between Mary and Francis that's one thing, but why have Mary suffer through something like that only to end up having an affair with someone else? Seems like a giant mess, not just ship-wise, but also for the characters.

**ds44** · 12-18-2016, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scififan2009 (View Post)

In Francis's defence, he was being blackmailed by Narcisse.

Unfortunately by the time he and Bash had eliminated the evidence the damage had already been done.

Yes, the way he dealt with the blackmail was horrible.

Quote:

Seriously though just reading about that has me annoyed about the poor execution of a rape story line. Like if they wanted to cause drama between Mary and Francis that's one thing, but why have Mary suffer through something like that only to end up having an affair with someone else? Seems like a giant mess, not just ship-wise, but also for the characters.

The problem is the writers seemed to not understand that people weren't just going to like mary cause she was raped. If anything it was an insult to anyone who has ever suffered from it. Plus the episode itself needed a trigger warning. The writers seemed incapable of creating drama that didn't involve adultry. But, the biggest problem is that they made their lead kind of unsympathetic despite being raped cause she was so petulant and thought Francis should just accept her non-discrete affair. Sorry but the whole its the husbands fault the wife got raped was just so damn gross. By the time, he took her back I wondered why.

scififan2009 · 12-18-2016, 07:10 PM

Worst thing was Francis allowing the affair. He wasn't even ignorant of what was going on.

It also didn't help that he had already had a child with Lola. Something Mary had not been able to give him. And when her own mother found out what had happened to her, her only worry was that her daughter could be pregnant with her attacker's child. Which she wasn't. But still, for one's own mother to care more about how this affected them politically.

hurricane eyes · 12-18-2016, 07:28 PM

Francis knew about the affair?!

**ds44** · 12-18-2016, 09:13 PM

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Originally Posted by hurricane eyes (View Post)

Francis knew about the affair?!

Yep. Mary yells at him that if he ever loved her, he would let her do this cause it was his fault she got raped. I was just face palming her entire existence in that back half.

Scottish_Queen · 12-18-2016, 10:01 PM

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Originally Posted by hurricane eyes (View Post)

Francis knew about the affair?!

Yeah, he at first forbade her from seeing Conde. Then the court basically had a party to find Francis a mistress. Mary was upset he forbade her from living her own life while he could have any woman he wanted. Francis then slept with Narcisse's neice...while Mary snuck off with Conde(though no sex happened.)

Then freaking Lola berates Francis after he slept with Narcisse's niece and tells him he should allow Mary to be with Conde. Francis eventually relents and tells her she's free to go to Conde if that will help her heal.

It was a giant mess all around.

**kerbear28** · 12-18-2016, 10:13 PM

^ Ugh. Yes, it was complete mess.

Discussion of Prophecy Spoiler Moved Over From Reign Board:

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Originally Posted by kerbear28 (View Post)

we did have that leaked call list for the finale episode that described a scene as "Mary is reminded of the prophecy." What prophecy do you think that refers to? I just don't think they are talking about the prophecy re: Francis' death...

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Originally Posted by Scottish_Queen (View Post)

I think the S3 finale was set up for the next prophecy story. Who went off to be a seer in order to protect Mary? And who said to Mary at the very end of S3 "I will come to you when you need me the most." Yep, Bash. I figured they might do something like this when he went off to be a seer. It gives them an out to re-write history anyway they want. They can justify anything by having Bash warn her ahead of time.

The prophecy that Mary revisits in the call sides Keri referred from the S4 finale, I believe is the one she gets from Bash early in S4. It's all in the casting audition scripts for Rizzio..I'd be happy to PM anyone the link to it if anyone wants it. I think I still have it somewhere. These casting scripts do not always play as aired so who knows if this will prove true. It seems like it probably will though based on the call sides from the finale.

But basically in this audition script for Rizzio--

*Mary and Bothwell are together in the woods for whatever reason
*They come across a man who has been thrown from a horse
*Man is David Rizzio. He was thrown from a horse and was rescued by Druids
*One of these Druids gave him a message to give to Queen Mary before she weds
*Mary realizes that Druid is Bash.
*The message/prophecy is that Mary has to choose between her personal happiness and an heir for England/Scotland but she can't have both. So if she chooses love, she'll be childless. If she chooses no love (meaning Darnley) then she will have a child who will grow up to unite England/Scotland in peace under his rule (Baby James)

Obviously, we know she chooses to have the child and sacrifice her own personal love. But when you look at the call sides for the series finale - it's seems clear to me that they probably follow history with a Reign spin. Just my spec mixed in with the call sides:

-Something happens to baby James - based on the bts pics - Darnley probably kidnaps him.
-Mary and Bothwell are probably in love at this point so Bothwell runs to play hero and kills Darnley (bts pics of them fighting/house burning, ect)
-Baby is returned, Mary thinks she's about to have it all - love with Bothwell and her child (call sides have baby being returned)
-She then revisits the prophecy and realizes...ugh...can't.have.both... (call sides have her revisiting prophecy)
-She's then blamed for Darnley's murder which was probably a set up from the start by Knox and the other evil Scottish lords, Knox calls for her arrest (call sides have Knox calling her for arrest when Bothwell returns)
-Mary sacrifies herself for the good of Bothwell and Scotland because she knows based on the prophecy...she can't have both personal love and a peaceful country united.

Assuming it does play something similiar to above, then the only real issue is time. Because only a few scenes later she's about to get her head cut off on Elizabeth's block (I'm assuming those bts pics with Elizabeth/Mary/chopping block are scenes at the end)

So either they fast forward time. Or Knox arrests her and has her shipped over to Lizzie ASAP for beheading because those two Queens are at war through all of S4 as we know. They don't have to follow real history there to make it believable that Liz would want her immediately killed. (Elizabeth afterall thinks Mary sent Lola and the assasin to kill her)

So who knows what's going to happen, but I can see a few ways a quicker timeline would work. Or I guess they could fwd to the future. And I wouldn't even be shocked if they did something monumentally crazy like have Mary and Elizabeth team up and go take out Knox together (hey..remember the BTS of Lizzie in armor?(Ok that is ridiculous speculation ;-)

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Originally Posted by NotDoneAbusingYou (View Post)

None of what you said below in anyway indicated that there is a chance Mary may live, if anything it points to the opposite.

It is a little ridiculous because Laurie said they will stick to history from day one and the always have. And As I have said, there is zero evidence that suggests anything else. If there were even the slightest hint that something else would happen, I'd say sure, maybe. But there's nothing. It's not speculation, it's just hope. Speculation has to be based on something. As my prior example showed...everyone thought Francis would live. Like almost everyone and they were all wrong.

Also, with Mary's slightly grey hair in those last photos, there is obviously a time lapse in the middle of the last episode.

sounds to me like she choses country over love, never realizing that it will also cost her life. That's why she is reminded of the prophecy. Maybe something she misunderstood at first.

And yes. Those casting sides can change. This version may have been written when they thought they could get Torrance back for a few episodes. Although, they may be able to pull it off without him anyway. But like I said, this bit of info doesn't help in figuring out if she lives or dies.

I hadn't seen this spoiler, Lindsay! You're analysis makes sense to me.

It's nice that they are incorporating Bash into the storyline. But...Poor Mary, having to choose between love and being a mother.

Heartbreaking.

The speculation about Mary and Lizzy teaming up to take out Knox is a little ridiculous, but I would love to see that!

Stelena&Bamon · 12-19-2016, 03:14 AM

Thanks for the prophecy info from the other thread

Quote:

Originally Posted by scififan2009 (View Post)

In Francis's defence, he was being blackmailed by Narcisse.

Unfortunately by the time he and Bash had eliminated the evidence the damage had already been done.

Yeah he was blackmailed but he didn't need to keep it from Mary. It was all extra and ridiculous. Francis was so foolish! I didn't feel sorry for him tbh. Especially when Narcisse caved so easily in the end.

Thankfully Conde got stabbed, Francis died and it all ended.

hurricane eyes · 12-19-2016, 09:56 AM

So Francis had a mini affair all his own after his wife was raped? Well now I'm not feeling too bad for him. Seems that storyline just made everyone into an idiot.

scififan2009 · 12-19-2016, 10:00 AM

Highlight of that season was Lola getting high.

Scottish_Queen · 12-19-2016, 10:07 AM

Just a round up of the casting call auditions for various new characters joining Reign in S4. All below are from actors that didn't get the part. Lots of little spoiler tidbits within them should Reign use these scripts in the show.

Leeza (Catherine's daughter, Queen of Spain. Not sure how many episodes she will be in this season)
https://vimeo.com/167668575
Catherine and Leeza talking/Leeza is NOT a fan of her mother...like at all.)

Prince Henri (Catherine's 3rd son, airs throughout S4)
https://vimeo.com/178224570
Colorful guy/He's not a fan of his brother Charles

Lord Darnley (character airs from the first episode of S1 through finale/Keira also airs throughout most of the season)
https://vimeo.com/166902758
https://vimeo.com/167763600
Darnley's first meeting with Mary/Darnley meets with his lover Keira/promises her he doesn't love mary, just wants to be king/promises to break Mary's heart and continue affair with Keira once he's king. Boy he seems like a great dude

Bothwell (Begins airing around episode 6-7)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqY0MH1Av0E
Mary has been avoiding him, doesn't want to talk. Bothwell can't understand why she married Darnley when she doesn't love him. Mary is closed off to love. Bothwell tells Mary of Darnley's treachery/Mary realizes he's secretly been the man helpiing her anonymously. Bothwell declares his love, Mary says they can't have future, she's married.

Lord Hamilton (also not sure how many episodes, probably recurring too based on history)
https://vimeo.com/183526138
Hamilton meets with Mary, she's trying to smooth relations between protestants and Catholics..as well as her new husband Darnley and the Hamiltons. Hamilton thinks she should have married him, not Darnley. Mary says she married Darnley because of his claim to the English throne. Hamilton's family murdered Darnley's grandfather/huge fued/Hamilton meets with Darnley who tries to make amends but ends up making it worse.
*Will Kemp, who has been cast as Darnely actually posted a part of this script on his IG so this script probably airs very similar to the video)

David Rizzio (character begins airing around 6-7th episode of the season)
https://vimeo.com/177937858
https://vimeo.com/178149721
Bothwell/Mary first meet Rizzio, Rizzio brings Mary a prophecy from Bash

Lord Ruthven (not sure how many episodes he's in, probably recurring based on history)
https://vimeo.com/187182105
Ruthven/Darnley planning to ambush Bothwell in Mary's chambers/They burst into the room, find only Rizzo/Ruthven calls Mary all sorts of names/ orders Darnely to kill Rizzio and take Mary's throne

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So Francis had a mini affair all his own after his wife was raped? Well now I'm not feeling too bad for him. Seems that storyline just made everyone into an idiot.

It was more of a one night stand and he only did it because Mary basically sanctioned it. She was really mad at the double standard. He can go sleep with whoever while she gets beheaded if she has an affair. Omg, it was the worst episode ever. So Francis relents and allows her to have an affair with Conde. He hates it but decides to let Mary go. Francis then tries to get with Lola...Lola declines. Then the Conde affair begins...and the show really lost it's mind from there. I'm probably in the minority but I generally could always understand both Francis and Mary regardless of how bad it got. She was a traumatized rape victim trying to find a way to survive in an age that told women to keep it quiet, and in an age that offered none of the emotional support we would get today. And Francis tried to do everything he could to help her, I thought he deserved husband of the year award by the end of it. They finally figured it all out by the season finale.

When I rewatch S2, I'll watch episodes 1-13...and then the last 2. Everything else was rough. Watch with the Fwd button handy lol.

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Fan Forum > General Discussion > Spoilers > Reign Spoilers and Speculation #52: Mary is finally home in Scotland. What does Season 4 have in store for our three queens?