Austenphile

He was proactiveabout Emma but he still hasn't shown that he cares about anything else. The scenes where he stopped Emma combined with the lack of spending anytime helping anyone else this episode just really rubbed me the wrong way when they have been telling us he's a hero now.

scififan2009

Sibling rivalry between Regina and Zelena aside, Rebecca Mader never stops being entertaining.

I just watched the clip. That expression she makes without her voice is priceless.

T'Lynn

Who istelling us that? All the pre season interviews about Hook said he will do anything to save the woman he loves and talked about his own past with the darkness. We were told Charming would be at his most heroic...

A heroes journey is a long road. He tried to break the curse the best way he knew how. We will see what comes next.

lianamed

I think, in the end, it all comes to *trust*. If we think about it, Snow forgave Regina after Neverland and not before. Yes, she was willing to save her life before that and she went to great lenghs to do it in 2B, but, as she said herself, she did it because she felt she owed Regina that because she killed Regina's mother in a particular cruel way.

But before that? Well, in season 2A Regina was truly trying to change for Henry, and she went as far as actively helping David bringing back two people she used to hate to SB. She even risked the one person she feared most (her abuser) coming back into her life because she was trying to change. And yet, because no one trusted her everyone blamed her for a murder she didn't commit and no one cared about telling her Emma took Henry away from SB. And why was that? Because they didn't *trust* her. I'm not blaming them for not trusting her, because they had their reasons. I'm just saying their forgiveness came *after* they realized she truly did love Henry, and was willing to do anything for him.

So, it's not exactly fair to expect Regina to be willing to forgive her sister and give her yet another second chance when Zelena has given her no reason to trust her. On the contrary, at every single oportunity that appears, Zelena only proves her she has no reason to trust her whatsoever. I mean, Regina gave her a second chance in 3B. What did Zelena do? She went to the past and killed Robin's wife in order to get to SB and pose as her. Why did she chose to do it? Probably to keep them apart AND get pregnant.

Then, unexpectedly, Regina saved her life from the Snow Monster, giving her a "second chance" without knowing it. What did Zelena do with that? And after being frozen and having Regina saving her life? Should I go on?

Bottom line is: there is a difference between forgiving someone and giving them a second chance and being stupid. At this point, after several opportunities Zelena had (and she did have those) to change and has proven repeatedly she doesn't want to, Regina would be stupid to let her guard down and let her free to do whatever she wants. She has to earn Regina's trust (and everyone else's including Robin's) first, just like Regina had to earn everyone else's.

I think becoming a hero is a journey and it doesn't come easily to any of the former villains. They are not comfortable with that mind setting, because they still do have Darkness inside them because of their past.

I don't blame Killiam for his depression over Emma, since he tried to become a hero *for her* basically, because he felll in love with her. But he spent more than a hundred years being a pirate, and taking whatever he wanted from life. Being selfless is not his first instinct, and just like being forgiving isn't Regina's. They are not there yet.

But, they have their moments and they are learning. I'd say Killiam is where Regina was, back in season 3B at the EF. Regina's first instinct was to take away her heart and after that, curse herself with a sleeping curse so that she wouldn't be *in pain*. She ended up helping and did some very good things, including saving Charming's life for Snow, for instance.

I've no doubt we are going to see Killian doing quite heroic and selfless things given time. Right now, he is mourning the loss of the woman he loves and is unable to see beyond getting her back at any cost.

T'Lynn

lianamed: I agree with a lot of what you are saying but I do also think that Snow forgiving Regina in 3B and the two of them coming close was a huge act on Snow's part because just a couple episodes earlier Regina admitted that she regretted nothing that she did to Snow. But because her lack of regret is what saved them at that moment it was forgiven because that whole mission was about saving Henry .. and they did.

I think that Regina having to pay the price (never seeing Henry again) made her finally regret her past actions and that is why they grew closer. From that point on Regina has been much more understanding and sympathetic.

CityGal

Thanks for the reminder and it's only the second episode!

By all indictions from spoilers, the mystery reveals itself over time, and the character clearly is involved with a heck of a lot more characters guessing on finding a solution.

Finally, so far he's the only one who knows about the door with the fancy lock. I bet it'll come up sooner or later.


Thanks, better said than I could at the moment.

Out of the Woods

tyftnt

Henceforth i pledge alliance to "The Arthur is a good man!" group See T'Lynn i'm behaving now

I'm 70% CS 10% Rumbeller 10% Snowing and now 10% OQ .
For me it's really hard to understand, any hate at all (not talking about here!) if it's about Ginnifer's life, Hook, Snowing, Regina, Rumple etc. I understand we all have the right to not like the characters (Blue Fairy Hint). But if this goes on, sooner or later Regina will be blamed of being eco unfriendly because she is polluting the EF due to excess of green and purple smoke, Rumple will be blamed by owning and destroying the Economy of Storybrooke, Emma will be blamed for parking her yellow car wildly in the streets, Hook will be blamed by unpaid taxes of the Jolly Roger at the docks, Snow will be blamed of leaving her contract at her primer school without indemnization lol People will always finds ways to upset good people.

I do understand though people behave very bad outside this place, with Ginnifer, and i hope we can have more Snowing those are wonderful episodes So i believe we are rather in the same ship and fight along with you Austenphile, helping each other, even if we "ship" different couples ! I have a long personal story why i came to like Hook so much, but at the end of it you'd be snoring Austenphile so i won't tell it lol

lianamed

I think Jane either doesn't like Regina, or she likes her being *evil*. Her writing isn't fair, most of the times, to where Regina is, as a character, right now. However, I also do know that whatever happens in an episode is not entirely from the writer's mind. That scene is probably supposed to be right where it is, and the end result would be Regina not being ready to give her another chance at this point in time.

But, regardless of who writes Regina, I see her a little bit as what Hook said in the première: she has the fire, but not the Darkness. In another words, she barks, but she doesn't really bite, not any more. So, whatever is she telling Zelena (only when I'm home will I be able to watch) isn't necessarily how she is going to act, once she is faced with Zelena's baby being born.

scififan2009

How far along would Zelena be after 6 weeks?

Randysgirl

I don't really consider watching the woman he loves turn into the DO and being devastated about that, pouting, but we all obviously have our own opinions.

Personally, I think breaking the curse, which is what he was trying to do throughout that episode, would be helpful to everyone else in the town. As far as everyone is aware, she is the biggest threat at the moment.

Tftnt!

T'Lynn - I agree with your comments about the Regina/Zelena storyline. I believe Zelena is there to be part of Regina's hero's journey (especially when it comes to forgiveness).

lianamed

It all depends on how pregnant she was before those 6 weeks. If she was 4 weeks, that would have made her 10 weeks, which would be around 2 months.

Usually we do count weeks when talking about pregnancy.

T'Lynn

I feel like this season is going to divide the fandom more than any before!

Should we schedule a weekly reminder of the things we agree about?

Roland is the cutest
Blue Fairy is the shadiest
OUAT promotional team is the worst


And for me and Belleislove:
Arthur is hot

koodles

That's a very nice post Out of the Woods!

Thanks for that.

Belleislove

Randysgirl

Agreed!

I would add - Leather is the sexiest lol