Spoilers - Gilmore Girls S&S #130 ~ We're Still Waiting For Santa - Page 7

caf123 · 01-04-2007, 09:13 PM

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Originally Posted by Sandlynn (View Post)

Oh, but you're not keeping up. Ciaobella promises that a tree is going to fall on my head

She said it might. She didn't promise ya anything.

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because Rory is going to call Luke "Daddy."

That's not what Ciaobella said.

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She's going to see Luke as the most important male figure in her life. The father she never had. The man who guided her through her life.

That's not what Ciaobella said either.

What are you responding to?

MickeyJr3000 · 01-04-2007, 09:16 PM

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Originally Posted by Ciaobella (View Post)

Ah, but it's Rory's thoughts and words about Luke in 7.11 that inspire Lorelai to write that letter. I guess Rory doesn't know what she's talking about either?

Either you know this for sure from your own personal spoiler sources and this tree can be chopped down, or you are speccing based on the information we have (and the tree will continue to be circled).

Is it A or B? Not for you to answer to us, but to answer to yourself. Just saying. We can spec all we want guys, but none of this can be laid to rest until it airs on screen to settle the debate for good.

That said...

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Seriously, what if in the letter Lorelai says that Luke was a great father figure to Rory for years? What will you all say? Will you just dismiss it as Lorelai being crazy? Or as the new writers not understanding the show?

A) Hee, if they write it, it must be true. Sorry to those who disagree, but if the letter actually says it, than some people may be disappointed that there was more 'tell' than 'show.' I for one feel we were 'show'ed plenty. It isn't a far stretch for Lorelai to say, in the midst of a very inspiring and persuasive letter about Luke's redeeming fatherly qualities, that he was a father figure to Rory.

That said...

B) It is LORELAI, not RORY, who is writing this letter, and while it is understandable that LORELAI could write this in the letter, this doesn't confirm its TRUTH unless Rory makes part of that input herself. Lorelai has, in the past, claimed that "Rory loves Luke" (Ep 5.16), and she probably will be willing to speak for Rory again in this letter. But we won't know for sure how Rory really feels about Luke, unless TPTB chooses to make Rory verballize it for us. Just because Lorelai said so, doesn't mean it MUST be true. After all, Lorelai's not the gospel.

Some (of course not all) Rory fans are very particular about this sort of thing. They aren't going to buy the 'fatherly figure Luke' just because Lorelai said it abd because of the past 6 years of Rory/Luke tidbits we have been fed. Some of them might even disagree that Rory cares about Luke at all considering the rarity of Luke/Rory moments on the show, which have been decreasing over the last few years.

Shu · 01-04-2007, 09:17 PM

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Originally Posted by lemon tart (View Post)

Which is exactly how I've always thought of him. But there are those that seem to need to embelish his role. Why I don't know.

really? interesting. i always got the sense you thought he didn't mean jack**** to her...

Captain Hawkeye · 01-04-2007, 09:18 PM

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Originally Posted by caf

ASP had no original intent.

What she did originally was to follow where the characters naturally led - that was one of the show's greatest strengths. She's less skilled at imposing story arcs - and the real problems started when she got bored, or angry, or burnt out, or whatever led her to start pulling soap opera plots and cheating storylines out of her hat.

Please confirm that you just said ASP had NO ORIGINAL INTENT THAT LL END UP TOGETHER. That people who say the pilot is a giant anvil are wrong. That ASP did not intend to imply anything, INCLUDING A LL REALATIONSHIP, in the pilot.

Sandlynn · 01-04-2007, 09:21 PM

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B) It is LORELAI, not RORY, who is writing this letter, and while it is understandable that LORELAI could write this in the letter, this doesn't confirm its TRUTH unless Rory makes part of that input herself. Lorelai has, in the past, claimed that "Rory loves Luke" (Ep 5.16), and she probably will be willing to speak for Rory again in this letter. But we won't know for sure how Rory really feels about Luke, unless TPTB chooses to make Rory verballize it for us. Just because Lorelai said so, doesn't mean it MUST be true. After all, Lorelai's not the gospel.

Some (of course not all) Rory fans are very particular about this sort of thing. They aren't going to buy the 'fatherly figure Luke' just because Lorelai said it abd because of the past 6 years of Rory/Luke tidbits we have been fed. Some of them might even disagree that Rory cares about Luke at all considering the rarity of Luke/Rory moments on the show, which have been decreasing over the last few years.

You got that right.

FuzzyCerts · 01-04-2007, 09:23 PM

I see some people still don´t see the light......

Tara Ashley · 01-04-2007, 09:25 PM

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Originally Posted by Sandlynn (View Post)

Luke has been more of a father figure to Rory than Richard? Seriously? Who has Rory bonded with and shared interests with? Who does she run to when her mother hurts her? Who does she look to for support, emotionally and materially? Who sent her to school, put a roof over her head, and food in her belly. And I mean paid for it, without putting a bill down in front of her?

I can't believe that ANYONE would put Luke before Richard in Rory's eyes. EVER.

You're kidding. A grandfather can't be a father figure because he doesn't have the literal title of father in relation to Rory? What difference does it make? Grandfather has the word father in it, if that makes it better. I don't care what she calls him, *he* was her father figure. I would expect JJs to understand that considering how they keep insisting that Luke was a father figure, and no where in "guy who owns the town diner" does the exact word "father" appear.

.

Sandlynn, I said none of this? I never said anything about Luke being more of a father than Richard. I said between Chris and Luke, Luke is my pick. And then I went on, in numerous posts, to state that I agreed with the Richard stuff. So please, don't attack if you don't have anything to attack.

And, I did NOT say that a grandfather can't be a father figure because he doesn't have the title. Someone please read my post and tell me if you interpret it that way, because I SURELY did not mean in that way. In fact, I said it made "no sense", my thoughts. And concluded it with a simple statement: I just never saw Richard as Rory's father figure. Again, watch what you attack.

Tara Ashley · 01-04-2007, 09:25 PM

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Originally Posted by Sandlynn (View Post)

Well, any man that pours her a cup of coffee.

Luke has been more of a father figure to Rory than Richard? Seriously? Who has Rory bonded with and shared interests with? Who does she run to when her mother hurts her? Who does she look to for support, emotionally and materially? Who sent her to school, put a roof over her head, and food in her belly. And I mean paid for it, without putting a bill down in front of her?

I can't believe that ANYONE would put Luke before Richard in Rory's eyes. EVER.

You're kidding. A grandfather can't be a father figure because he doesn't have the literal title of father in relation to Rory? What difference does it make? Grandfather has the word father in it, if that makes it better. I don't care what she calls him, *he* was her father figure. I would expect JJs to understand that considering how they keep insisting that Luke was a father figure, and no where in "guy who owns the town diner" does the exact word "father" appear.

.

Sandlynn, I said none of this? I never said anything about Luke being more of a father than Richard. I said between Chris and Luke, Luke is my pick. And then I went on, in numerous posts, to state that I agreed with the Richard stuff. So please, don't attack if you don't have anything to attack.

And, I did NOT say that a grandfather can't be a father figure because he doesn't have the title. Someone please read my post and tell me if you interpret it that way, because I SURELY did not mean in that way. In fact, I said it made "no sense", my thoughts. And concluded it with a simple statement: I just never saw Richard as Rory's father figure. Again, watch what you attack.

lancer1993 · 01-04-2007, 09:25 PM

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Originally Posted by Sandlynn (View Post)

Oh, but you're not keeping up. Ciaobella promises that a tree is going to fall on my head because Rory is going to call Luke "Daddy." She's going to see Luke as the most important male figure in her life. The father she never had. The man who guided her through her life.

I think it's a spoiler. She sounds pretty sure. She must know.

That was just posted but I doubt she will call him DADDY, maybe just to say how important he is/was in there life or father like but I doubt we'll here him being called daddy from Rory.

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Originally Posted by Ciaobella

Never said that. Now that's a real work of fiction. The warning about the tree - yes. But not that other fiction. But then again, if you say it enough you might believe I did.

Don't you love how people twist things here!

Shu · 01-04-2007, 09:26 PM

seeing the light would be people understanding that we are all on the freaking same side that this is not a war. But, alas I fear it will never happen and all parties will only be negative and never try to have a civil discussion ever again!

Tara Ashley · 01-04-2007, 09:26 PM

Sorry for the double post- how do I delete???

Ciaobella · 01-04-2007, 09:27 PM

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Originally Posted by MickeyJr3000 (View Post)

A) Hee, if they write it, it must be true. Sorry to those who disagree, but if the letter actually says it, than some people may be disappointed that there was more 'tell' than 'show.' I for one feel we were 'show'ed plenty. It isn't a far stretch for Lorelai to say, in the midst of a very inspiring and persuasive letter about Luke's redeeming fatherly qualities, that he was a father figure to Rory.

That said...

B) It is LORELAI, not RORY, who is writing this letter, and while it is understandable that LORELAI could write this in the letter, this doesn't confirm its TRUTH unless Rory makes part of that input herself. Lorelai has, in the past, claimed that "Rory loves Luke" (Ep 5.16), and she probably will be willing to speak for Rory again in this letter. But we won't know for sure how Rory really feels about Luke, unless TPTB chooses to make Rory verballize it for us. Just because Lorelai said so, doesn't mean it MUST be true. After all, Lorelai's not the gospel.

Mickey, this spoiler from Nicolalala:

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Spoiler: After running into Luke and April, Lorelai and Rory remember who/what Luke has been to them.

combined with this part of the ep description:

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Lorelai struggles to write the letter until she and Rory run into Luke and April at the mall and Lorelai suddenly remembers how important Luke has always been in Rory's life. Inspired, Lorelai writes the letter and mails it to Luke's attorney.

....lead me to believe that Rory vocally participates in their reminiscing about Luke. Unless Lorelai can read minds now.

aussiekate · 01-04-2007, 09:27 PM

Maybe I am wrong but doesn't the episode description say that Lorelai AND Rory discuss Luke and the role he has played in BOTH of their lives?? That reads as Rory verbalizing to me??? I doubt Rory sees Luke as a father figure but I don't doubt that she would acknowledge that he has had a sizeable role in her life - Rory might not high five Luke everytime she walks into the diner but she is is an intelligent, caring, sensitive young woman who sees the good in him and has no reason not to.

ETA: In my mind, imagining that Rory would downplay the role Luke has played in her life is attacking the character of Rory herself. She's a good person with a good heart (unlike someone else near and dear (choke) to her) and I can't imagine she wouldn't acknowledge that Luke has done good by both her and her mother for many, many years. That's not calling him Daddy or asking him to adopt her - it's called recognizing a support she might not have otherwise had growing up.

Sandlynn · 01-04-2007, 09:27 PM

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Originally Posted by FuzzyCerts (View Post)

I see some people still don´t see the light......

No, I have not joined your little cult of Luke.

FuzzyCerts · 01-04-2007, 09:28 PM

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Originally Posted by genki (View Post)

seeing the light would be people understanding that we are all on the freaking same side that this is not a war. But, alas I fear it will never happen and all parties will only be negative and never try to have a civil discussion ever again!

Well, we believe what we wanna believe, but I think after the ep aired, some have to change their minds.....

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No, I have not joined your little cult of Luke.

I can wait. You will.