Spoilers - Gilmore Girls ~ Luke/Lorelai Analysis & Speculation #394

Mots15 · 04-21-2007, 09:58 AM

Gilmore Girls
Luke/Lorelai Analysis & Speculation

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Thread Rules

This thread is to discuss spoilers of the show, which includes analysis and speculation of what might happen on the show, or what people would like to see happen regarding Luke and Lorelai. The thread should not be used as episode discussion thread. That should be done on the Gilmore Girls board.
Be respectful. Not everyone is going to agree with you at all times. It's perfectly fine to disagree with someone as long as it is done respectfully, but do not attack other posters.
Don't tease! If you have spoilers that you aren't able or willing to share just yet, it's inappropriate to come on the forum and tell everyone that.
Please note that asking and/or begging for more spoilers isn't necessary. Our sources give what they can, whenever it is possible, and when the time is right. Asking over and over again won't make them come any quicker, or any more detailed.

Feel free to discuss everything about Luke & Lorelai. Have fun posting!

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Episode Descriptions & Spoilers: Season 7

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Episode 7.19: It's Just Like Riding a Bike
Air date: 24 April 2007

Written by: Jennie Snyder
Directed by: Lee Shallat Chemel

The CW: Lorelai stops into Luke's diner for breakfast for the first time since their break-up, but finds they are awkward and uncomfortable together. Later, Lorelai's Jeep breaks down and she asks Luke to help her shop for a new car. While they look at cars, Lorelai and Luke's irritation with one another finally explodes into a fight, which Lorelai secretly takes as a good sign. Meanwhile, Paris gets accepted to numerous law schools and medical schools, and decides she must break up with Doyle so their relationship won't influence her choice of a graduate school. Finally, Rory gets a surprising letter that will impact her future plans.

TV Guide: Soon after stopping into the diner for the first time since the breakup, Lorelai asks Luke to go with her while she shops for a new car, but the outing ends in a big fight. Meanwhile, Paris gets accepted to several medical and law schools, and decides to end her relationship with Doyle so that he won't be a factor in her decision; and Rory receives a letter that will alter her future.

Lorelai Needs a New Car - courtesy of dreamslut
Lorelai's new car- courtesy of Mots15
Doll house takes the brunt of someone's anger - courtesy of Mots15
Awkward trip to the car dealership for LL - courtesy of Nicolalala
Teaser is Lorelai in the diner - courtesy of gossipcom

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Episode 7.20: Lorelai? Lorelai?
Air date: 1 May 2007

Written by: David S. Rosenthal
Directed by: Bethany Rooney

The CW: LORELAI ROCKS A KARAOKE BAR ─ With graduation looming, Rory (Alexis Bledel)is anxiety-ridden over her future, so Lorelai (Lauren Graham) tries to cheer her up with a day of eating and shopping. Lorelai notices happily that Luke (Scott Patterson) is once again wearing the baseball cap she gave him, and invites him to join her and Rory for karaoke night at a local bar. After a few drinks, Lorelai takes the stage to sing a heartfelt number which is obviously directed at Luke. Logan returns from a business trip to California and comes to see Lorelai to discuss his future with Rory. Melissa McCarthy, Keiko Agena, Liza Weil, Sean Gunn, Kelly Bishop and Edward Herrmann also star. Bethany Rooney directed the episode written by David S. Rosenthal.

TV Guide: When Rory stresses out over life after graduation, Lorelai takes her out for a day of shopping and eating. Then Lorelai invites Luke to join them in the evening for karaoke night at a bar, where she sings a song intended for Luke to hear. Later, Logan returns from a business trip and visits Lorelai to talk about his future with Rory.

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Episode 7.21: Unto The Breach
Air date: 8 May 2007

Written by: David Babcock & Jennie Snyder
Directed by: Lee Shallat Chemel

The CW: LOGAN PROPOSES ON THE DAY RORY GRADUATES FROM YALE ─ On the eve of Rory’s (Alexis Bledel) graduation, Emily (Kelly Bishop) and Richard (Edward Herrmann) throw her a party and perform a song in her honor. At the party, Lorelai (Lauren Graham) and Christopher (David Sutcliffe) are reunited for the first time since their separation, and both are relieved to find they can still be friends. Logan (Matt Czuchry) surprises everyone at the party by proposing to Rory, but she is too shocked to give him an answer and begs Lorelai to help her decide what to do. On graduation day, Rory and Paris (Liza Weil) receive their diplomas, and Rory finally gives Logan her answer. Meanwhile, Lorelai is embarrassed about her karaoke serenade to Luke (Scott Patterson) the night before, and Luke is hurt when he overhears her saying it didn’t mean anything. Melissa McCarthy and Sean Gunn also star. Lee Shallat Chemel directed the episode written by David Babcock & Jennie Snyder

Luke is at graduation - courtesy of Saranoh
Luke does not attend Rory's graduation - courtesy of Mozzarella @ TWoP

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Episode 7.22: Bon Voyage
Air date: 15 May 2007

Written by:
Directed by: Lee Shallat Chemel

more

Luke Plans Rory's Party - courtesy of Nicolalala
Luke and Lorelai Summer Trips Canceled - courtesy of Nicolalala
Lorelai Cancels Trip A Week Early - courtesy of Looney @ TWoP
Final Scene Mirrors Pilot Final Scene - courtesy of Nicolalala

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Other Spoilers:

No L/L sex scene this season - courtesy of Saranoh

Luke's summer trip canceled - courtesy of gossipcom

Singing isn't cheesy - courtesy of massamin @ TWoP

Luke and Lorelai romantically involved by end of season - courtesy of lancer

Lorelai to sing Fernando - courtesy of gossipcom

The chuppah has returned home - courtesy of copperboom

LG Encounter - courtesy of zoobymoo

Ask Ausiello:

April 18 2007: Season 8 Announcement Imminent

April 11 2007: Things are looking up

Mar 28 2007: I Will Always Love You

Mar 21 2007: Rory's grad is not the finale.

Mar 14 2007: LL fight ends positively!

Mar 07 2007: Car Shopping, Fighting, and Singing - Oh My!

Feb 28 2007: Welcome back to the diner?

Feb 14 2007: Apologies All Around

Jan 31 2007: Married? Just kidding.

Jan 23 2007: Married, baby, 8th season

Dec 20 2006: Lorelai and Christopher Fall Out

Dec 6 2006: Luke in, Christopher out

Nov 15 2006: Troubles ahead for LC, Luke helps Emily

Nov 8 2006: Poignant & Green

Nov 1 2006: Blah, blah, blah

Apr 25 2006: Reaction to interview

Ausiello Report/Vodcast:

Apr 15 2007: Short Season 8?

Apr 10 2007: More Emotion Please

Mar 15 2007: Christiane Amanpour Makes An Appearance

Feb 28 2007: Lorelai enters the diner

Jan 29 2007: LG gets producer credits

Oct 24 2006: DR Interview about elopement

Sept 14 2006: Spoilerganza

July 17 2006: Interview with Dave Rosenthal

July 17 2006: TCA Summer Press Tour

June 7 2006: Interview with Lauren Graham

Apr 24 2006: Interview with Amy & Dan

General Spoilers:
*if you have a general spoiler to share, please PM the thread starter so that they can update the list below*

LG & David Grae/Rosenthal interviews - courtesy of gilmore maniac & Mots15

Ausiello Right About S8 - courtesy of sportygirl @ TWoP

Sookie doesn't attend graduation - courtesy of Saranoh

Season 8 looks more likely than not courtesy of SassyPaws

Season 8 decision already made - courtesy of AkaranafeatMeeko, Saranoh, and dirty twin

More on S8 - courtesy of SassyPaws at TWoP

Paris & Doyle breakup - courtesy of ScottPAdmirer at TWoP

Doll house is back next to the new TV - courtesy of glo

MM Cast in Pilot - courtesy of caf123

Dollhouse Destroyed - courtesy of JSW & SarahLovesLogan

Tour Reports:

April 13th Tour Info and more.- courtesy of LoopyGiggles@TV.com

April 12th Tour Info - courtesy of sd6 @ TwoP

April 12th Tour info – courtesy of cchurley at TWoP

April 11th Tour Info - courtesy of alwaysbeenyou

April 10th Tour Info - courtesy of malangue

April 9th Tour Info and pics– courtesy of angel312 @ TWoP

April 4th & 6th Tour Info – courtesy of Katiegg108

April 4th Tour Info – courtesy of lulu1960 @TWoP

April 2nd Tour Info – courtesy of lulu1960 and angel312 @TWoP

March 7th Tour Info - courtesy of Tru_Slayer at TV.Com

March 19th Tour Info - courtesy of little_earthquake

March 16th Tour Info - courtesy of BigB

March 16th Tour Info More - courtesy of glo1196@mac.com

Video and Promos:

7.19 DC - courtesy of Cappuccino

7.19 Global Promo – courtesy of genki & 2ggObsessed

7.19 Promo – courtesy of fan1bsb97

Liza Weil Video Interview

Ed Herrmann Video Interview

Podcast and Clip Transcripts:

EH Interview Transcript

LW InterviewTranscript

7.19 Director's Cut Transcript - courtesy of lancer1993

20 April 2007 Podcast - courtesy of lorelaisgirl

Clips:

Episode 7.18 - Hay Bale Maze - courtesy of blaab
Episode Clips

Season 7 Episodes
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Season 7 Promo Images
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All episode descriptions and promotional pictures are provided by The CW and Fraz, unless otherwise noted.

Cappuccino · 04-21-2007, 10:01 AM

Thanks

Luke and Lorelai

7.19 - Lilmelodie, Peachypeep, Cappuccino, Wheredidtheanvilsgo?, Rosefurcoat , AkaranafeatMeeko, Tea-Bee, Vaso, Mirella, maglori, Sparkling Star, Wilpen, withbatedbreath, Gemini8525, mary55, little_earthquake, voncey, leonana, genki, Tara Ashley, ~JJ_lunatic~, Lorelai&Luke<3 (22)

7.20 - Lancer, Tazzed, Ggava, Bigb, Cappie, juststandingstill, Katiegg108, Gymtig, glo1196@mac.com, lorelaisgirl, CineFille, genuinelorelai, MissMarie01, stephrox, almondeyes, obiswee_pie, Javalava86, LLLovers, ele309, Mots15, elduccia, schmusibu, smileyGGfan, blaab, dirty twin, beautifullauren, Spikette, smeagolkitten (28)

7.21 - Fuzzycerts, LG - Life's Good, Mag13, CoffeeSlut, GeorgeIII, MickeyJr3000, Joannathe1, xmonalpx, 2ggObsessed, nst (10)

7.22 - wej5541, SarahLovesLogan, caf123, commodore (4)

Wheredidtheanvilsgo? · 04-21-2007, 10:02 AM

Thanks Mots

GGAva · 04-21-2007, 10:03 AM

Thanks for the new thread.

**Katiegg108** · 04-21-2007, 10:08 AM

Thanks for the new thread!

Quote:

Or maybe Zach and Jackson are going to get them FROM the car and bring them to the tarp?

I like how Luke is standing under the tarp, hands in pockets, just looking on. He's got to feel so proud of himself, lol. I would.

That seems right with Zach and Jackson. I was wondering earlier why they're holding the umbrellas.

Luke standing in the back is perfect. If Luke really does plan this all as a surprise, even for Lorelai, her realizing he did this and then looking around for him will be great. Especially if he remains in the background even after they get there.

blaab · 04-21-2007, 10:14 AM

Thanks for the new thread Mots!

Caf, here is my reaction ... it gotten somewhat out of hand and is way too long ... but well it is a response

Quote:

Originally Posted by caf123 (View Post)

Merely because the four of them don't see it, doesn't make it not so. We've watched the show and we've seen it.

Just because I personally would have reacted differently to a guy like Chris or more him in the role of dad, or so I would like to think, does not overrule what I have seen on this show. Lorelai and Rory were happy when he was around and yeah some words have been said by Rory about her frustrations, but basically I have seen her been happy with what she could get out of her dad. Lorelai, I feel, has this mixture of reasons for not telling him more clearly he should have been around more. First off because I felt she was just a kid when leaving the Mansion and she kind of liked this life just with Rory. This her and her kid against the world thing. In the beginning even living in a somewhat fantasy world together (this is me remembering Rory telling Emily about the potting shed and how they sat together in the grass enjoying the music from the Inn). Of course part of it was also the feeling Lorelai HAD to do it on her own from her perspective (she of course could have stayed with Emily and Richard, but had her own reasoning for not doing so, different subject I guess ...). Secondly, I think Lorelai has felt some guilt after turning his proposal down when she was 16/17. Her parents certainly were also for this option, so was Chris. She was the one deciding this on her own, against the other relevant persons in this matter wishes. But thirdly, I think Lorelai knows Chris very well. She, I think, knew he was not the strongest person around, this doesn't mean he didn't mean a lot to her. I think she has always seen potential in him and that is why he remained a possibilty to her, IF he could just get his act together. So yeah, I think for some time she did see that he was flawed (probably never stopped seeing that), but I think Lorelai does realise she is so herself ... and maybe that is also a reason why she is not so keen on judging him. And I believe, she did think he had his act more together in the latter half of Season 6. He did seem to have things more together and he was there for Rory more and was trying. This didn't make him that possibility again until things were over in Lorelai's mind with Luke. I never doubted she wanted Luke, loved Luke and all, over Chris, while being with Luke.

Quote:

I get her wanting to be friends, from the perspective that's been shown this year. That's what I'm talking about.

I get her wanting to be friends from the perspective I have seen all these years.

Quote:

From an LL "shipper" perspective, it totally undermines any LL reunion, because we're told a man like Christopher was Lorelai's "wonderful possibility" the whole time she said she was "all in" with Luke. Who would have been so moved by Say Something, knowing that?

I don't think he was a possibility when she was with Luke. I have never had a doubt in my mind that she truely wanted Luke (like I said just above), but when things were over with Luke and she felt they were definitely over ... and I believe that is what she meant by admitting 'the mistake', because she finalized things by that, Chris did become that wonderful possibilty again. One thing was over completely in her mind or there was no going back, because of that Mistake and maybe in her mind even before that. Because from her perspective she was hurt very much when with Luke and had no other choice than to end it, she tried within her possibilities and still she did not feel she was being included in his life. So even though she loved him greatly and wanted nothing more than to start their life together from her perspective that was not what Luke wanted.

So what is my point here, oh yeah, I am still very moved by SS ...

Quote:

She said it was wrong to sleep with Christopher - and I'm not looking for long-winded explanations, but why? Just a few words would do! If not for Luke, then for us! Did she not think the engagement was over? Was it only wrong because it was too soon? Does she actually think Christopher is an equally good man but somehow just not "the one"? What does that say about her?

Why it was a mistake, I have many thoughts, I don't need one to be picked, I am sure it is a mixture for Lorelai also

I think she felt it was a mistake because she ended things, finalized things by that one night, it was a mistake because she didn't really want Chris that night, but clearly wanted Luke, but was so hurt, she needed to forget and/or hold on. It was a mistake because it was wrong to so quickly after in her perspective ending things with Luke ending up sleeping with Chris, it was wrong because she knew (afterwards, when reasoning returned, this was something that must have hurt Luke tremendously). It was wrong, because he apparantly did want her, but she couldn't say yes to him arriving the next day with his truck filled up ... because she had already slept with Chris. Even though during that scene my heart broke for Luke I definitely also sympathised with Lorelai, because if anything this showed how one screwed up moment, could have incredible consequences, even though I do think there were many moments leading up to this that already showed screwed-up-ness. And I am sure this must have hurt her also very much. And all this I would think supported Lorelai in NOT wanting to think about Luke anymore, not wanting to deal with the break-up, not wanting to even ponder about what could have been if she just wouldn't have ... because it hurt so badly. So her way of dealing, was to try to end this chapter of Luke completely. As if he wasn't there anymore and well Chris sure was handy in that department. He ceized the moment and yep she jumped. Because well before Luke and I did feel she tried to completely wipe Luke from memory and/or even made him look worse than he was (because that does make it easier to distance yourself from someone), Chris was this wonderful possibilty ... but then they returned to SH and there was Luke ... he was I feel so around, maybe not physically, but he was everywhere still. And she slowly became aware of him again ... you can only convince yourself of something not existing for that long I guess ... and there was the rub. The moment she led her guard down a little when trying to start up her "normal" SH life again while being married to Chris ... Luke popped up in indirect and direct ways ... and well the messiness between Chris and Lorelai started. Chris felt like second choice ... and even though she tried to convince him otherwise, she finally, for me during that dog-funeral (marriage and dog-licence anyone

) not only realised her and Chris were over, but she also knew he was right. She did have these huge feelings for Luke, but things were also not right between them (when he didn't show up in the hospital, there was this part of her that was not surprised, but most importantly to me that meant this wonderful possibility was not as wonderful in reality ... and therefor this possibility is over and done with for good.

LORELAI: Yes?
SOOKIE: If there were no Luke, I mean no Luke in the past, no Luke in the picture...
LORELAI: Yeah?
SOOKIE: Well, would it be Christopher? Would he be "the one"?
[Lorelai doesn’t answer]

Well, according to this ... that whole marriage was a reaction to Lorelai loosing Luke and the hurt she felt accomponied from that and the need to run from the hurt and hide out. Chris was only "the one" as a reaction to the hurt ... which makes Lorelai saying to the shrink, I think I only ever loved Luke (or something), to be the case!

Quote:

Will she ever care that Luke turned his life inside out for his daughter (even if he went about it in a cack-handed way), when Christopher could never be bothered to put his daughters first? Or is Christopher supposed to be redeemed in our eyes by merely turning up for Rory's college graduation?

First off, Lorelai does not decide who comes to the graduation. That I feel is up to Rory. And yeah I have definitely seen Lorelai care about Luke and his daughter ... that is why she also wrote that character reference ... even if she already knew Christopher had Issues with Luke, she was gonna do that. No doubt in her mind. Even when it was difficult for her, even when it meant there could be troubles in her marriage, which I felt she knew could occur because of that, because why hide it otherwise? She immediately said yes, because she did appreciate it very much that Luke was/is that kind of guy. So even though I did see her try a lot to make this marriage a success, there was no way she was going to say NO. And there has been no indication whatsoever for me that she didn't want Luke to be there for April, to built a relationship with her. She just also wanted to feel as if in a relationship with him. Chris imo does not need redemption and therefor has to be at the graduation. I think the last talk(s) Lorelai and Chris had about their marriage already showed to me a more matured Chris and I already have seen Chris trying to have a better relationship with Rory way before that.

Quote:

Doesn't work for me. If it works for the new and unimproved Lorelai, then could someone please explain how or why? Because either she still hasn't found that shiny new brain of hers, or I'm just not getting it. And I need more than a pretty face to enjoy a show.

I think it has been mentioned a couple of times what some have seen as improvements for Lorelai. I have nothing new to add to that. I am sorry it doesn't work for you. I wished it would for you. But well it does work for me and I am pretty sure I will also be enjoying L/L the next four eps! And I am sure there is plenty you see differently Caf, because well, that is just the way I guess it is. This is how I see it and I am going to leave it at that. I guess we will disagree until this show is really over

ETA This is all or mostly the way I see it from Lorelais POV, there of course is also a Lukes POV ... I am not thinking he is the one to blame. I still feel both messed up badly and their individual messiness lead to this all. Both could not snap the other one out of it ...

Okee, out of here for a bit! Again, sorry for the length of this post, I am confused myself

glo · 04-21-2007, 10:31 AM

Wow that was a lot to catch up on. I thought we ad knew info, but wow there was a lot of bashing. I love L/L and their characters, both very flawed, and both very much in need of eachother. JMHO...

Thanks Motss for the new thread....

Cappuccino · 04-21-2007, 10:35 AM

Wonderful possibility my a$§. She took him cause he was there and willing and too stupid and leaves the thinking to his little friend in his pants. She knew him and knew what she would get if she starts something with him. Like she said in the hospital part of me wasn't even surprised you weren't there. She transfered that to other aspects as well. The one she wants seems to not want her so she turns to the guy she knows wants her more than anything. Who doesn't put a stupid kid before her.

ETA

IF he was such a wonderful possibility than why the hack didn't she move with him ? Why didn't she let him have his way with her when he announced so romantically lets make a baby ? Why didn't she wanna do the wedding party and renew the vows in front of her family, friends and oh yeah their daughter ?

Yep wonderful possibility indeed. I so bought that speech

withbatedbreath · 04-21-2007, 10:52 AM

thank you Mots.

Mots15 · 04-21-2007, 11:04 AM

I would be willing to bet that if someone was to ask Lorelai again who she wants, she'd not be able to answer. Well, she wouldn't answer at any rate, in fear of getting hurt. Because she wants Luke. (I really hate the word wants now, btw). Christopher was only a possibility because Lorelai decided to try the opposite of what she is used to - the plan of one Emily Gilmore. It didn't work out. And, in the end, she only wanted to want Christopher because Luke had made it clear [to Lorelai] that he didn't want her anymore, that the proposal and marriage idea was her doing, it wasn't a big deal to him, and he wasn't angry, but just wanted to be Luke Danes - diner owner and coffee pourer because that is all he was meant to be to her. Lorelai was left feeling like dirt on a rug, insignificant to Luke. Yeah, we knew Luke didn't mean it, everything was said out of anger and regret, but Lorelai didn't know that at all. She only heard the words and took them for what they were. It was like being hit by a bulldozer. She didn't know any better than to believe Luke. But even after all of that, after trying to push Luke out of her life, believing what Luke said, Chris wasn't the guy she wanted. He was only someone she wished she could want to make her life seem complete. After everything Luke said, she still had feelings for him, not Christopher. She still couldn't want someone else, even if her life would probably had been easier than pining away for someone she could never have.

I think it would suck if someone came up to me and said "I want to want you." Because if you finish that sentence it's "I want to want you, but I don't want you." All because she has feelings for someone else and someone she doesn't think has those feelings back for her.

Wheredidtheanvilsgo? · 04-21-2007, 11:14 AM

Mots.. I totally agree with you. I just don't get the Lorelai hate. Not one person has gone through life without making some mistakes.

That picture of Luke; Swear to god his eyes can hypnotize me. Beautiful man!

~~ CherylS ~~ · 04-21-2007, 11:15 AM

I would love Lorlelai to tell Luke that even though he is over her that she isn't over him. That singing that song was a little slip up and she hates that it makes him uncomfortable or hinders their budding friendship. That she just wants his friendship and she's going to work on getting over him.
She really had no reason not to believe him because the only other time he lied to her was about April. She understood the reasons behind that. For months he had been putting her aside and then he tells her he's over her and she was more into it. I know it wasn't true but she had been avoiding him because she knew he was going to say that. Isn't really about Luke putting his daughter first in his life or even over Lorelai. It was about Luke not including his fiance into his entire life. Big difference. I guess it was working for him but it never worked for me.

spunks · 04-21-2007, 11:25 AM

Great posts Blaab and Mots; very insightful and thoughtful, and right on the money IMO. I think you both analyzed the LL breakup perfectly, especially the part about 'wanting to want' Christopher. Alot of people, myself included, hated when Lorelai said that to Chris, but you know what, Mots is right...we need to keep in mind that the end of that line is, 'but I don't want you'.

Although it did bother me at the time, I now understand why Lorelai said it. It would have been so much easier if only she had truly wanted Chris. It would have pleased her parents, it would have pleased her daughter, the nuclear family would finally be together. She would have had the whole package she wanted so desperately. But no matter how hard she tried, she couldn't escape the truth: Chris would never be the package she wanted!! Dirty, but true!!

And thanks for the thread Mots.

vaso · 04-21-2007, 11:26 AM

Thanks Mots

Nope not getting worked up again. Maybe i'm just too tired today lol

~~ CherylS ~~ · 04-21-2007, 11:58 AM

Just sitting back and letting the story unfold...
Nice place to be.