n e r b l e

http://www.swiftvets.com/

Basically a group of vets who were in Vietnam w/ Kerry formed a group to talk about what Kerry is like and what happened in Vietnam w/ him. In addition they are supposed to be launching a campaign of ads in the near future.

last beautiful girl

Couldn't that be potentially damaging to his campaign? If they do bring up stuff relevant to Vietnam, I really hope it's in good taste and not dragging his name through the mud for stuff he did in the 60s when he was young and trying to serve his country. I mean, I don't necessarily want them making him out to be a war hero if he wasn't, but unless it's relevant to the campaign, it shouldn't go public.

n e r b l e

Well if he's not being truthful about what happened we should know. Also he's basing a LOT of his campaign on his experience in Vietnam. I think it's important to know if that's a valid premise.

*Lauren

They have the right. If Kerry can prove what he says, I'm sure he will.

He defentitly should release all his records though.

ceilirose

There was a thread on this topic earlier..here's the link:

http://www.fanforum.com/forums/showt...threadid=15045

Here's the link to a CBS report that gives some background on the story:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/...in615566.shtml

One of the founders of this group is John O'Neill. He served in Vietnam after Kerry and was hand picked by Nixon to debate Kerry in the 70's on national TV. He's got an axe to grind and that's fine but this story had been going around since spring and it's not going anywhere. In fact I saw a poll in which even Republicans think of Kerry as a war hero. These people just look petty in trying to bring him down on this issue. Maybe the Vietnam Vets who support Kerry and this group should have it out. Now that would be an interesting conversation.

Should the Democrats keep on bringing up Bush's DUI or that he had a self-admitted drinking problem until the age of 40? Keep on trying to smear him like what is being done to Kerry? Is this what this election is going to be about? How about the rumor that one of Bush's girlfriends had an abortion when it was illegal? It's all b.s. and doesn't have one thing to do with the election on either side.

Talk about what Bush and Kerry have done and what they will do in the future...not that some group that may have ulterior motives.

Here's the link to Kerry's military records that were released earlier this year..Bush's records are there as well:

http://news.findlaw.com/legalnews/li...2004/docs.html

Katis

I think what this group has to say is just as relevant as what the vietnam vets who have been supporting Kerry are saying. People have made a big deal about how he has men he served with in Vietnam supporting him, it would be a little hypocritical to say that we should just ignore what the other side has to say.

ceilirose

No one is saying to ignore it..I'm just saying that because of the people behind it and the fact that it's been around for months and isn't sticking..well then there may be ulterior motives behind the group. It's a bunch of you know what as far as I'm concerned and keeps people from dealing with what Kerry and Bush are doing right now.

Kerry's military records are out in the open and anyone who cares can read them for themselves.

SuperDeluxe

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ceilirose


Should the Democrats keep on bringing up Bush's DUI or that he had a self-admitted drinking problem until the age of 40? Keep on trying to smear him like what is being done to Kerry? [QUOTE]

Apples and oranges. It is Kerry who keeps on bringing up his Service in Vietnam. If he is going to be bringing it up to show that he is with the military or whatever, all aspects of that should be looked at.

ceilirose

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SuperDeluxe
[QUOTE]Originally posted by ceilirose


Should the Democrats keep on bringing up Bush's DUI or that he had a self-admitted drinking problem until the age of 40? Keep on trying to smear him like what is being done to Kerry?

Quote:

Apples and oranges. It is Kerry who keeps on bringing up his Service in Vietnam. If he is going to be bringing it up to show that he is with the military or whatever, all aspects of that should be looked at.

Then all aspects of Bush's character should be looked at as well and in detail, correct? He's a straight shooter, says what he means, he's a strong leader, etc.,etc.

He's the leader of the one superpower in the world and has had a history of heavy drinking and been irresponsible enough to drive under the influence. What does that say about his character? That's one of his strengths, correct?

This is all an attempt to smear Kerry's character, isn't it? Do you want someone who may have lied about his Vietnam service or do you want the leader of the free world to have a substance abuse issue? I don't think it's comparing apples and oranges at all.

But I'll give it to the Conservative/Republican groups who do this kind of stuff. They know how to organize and they know how to badger the the media to get their message out. The Democrats really need to learn from them.

But you know what..all this other stuff is still b.s. because it's doesn't solve Iraq, the health care problem or the huge deficit which are the real problems in this country.

n e r b l e

this is going to sound mean and it is but...

the reason that i think that the dems are not going to and won't hammer on bush's drinking is b/c look at sen. kennedy. bush may have had a history of drinking and driving but he didn't leave a woman who was not his wife in a car crash to drown after he drove into a lake.

if you'll recall the whole slogan of the reps in the 1988 election, "Where was Bush (sr) during the Iran Contra, ect, ect, ect?" "Dry, sober and at home with his wife."

*Lauren

I wasn't aware Teddy Kennedy was running for president.

Besides, what happened at Chapaquidik (ugh) are very, very well known. Is Bush's DUI as well known?

ceilirose

Hah! Does Kerry know that Kennedy is running for President?

That's a pretty illogical reason but I wouldn't put it past the RNC to use it if push comes to shove.

n e r b l e

all i'm saying is that people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. kennedy is a US senator, not exactly a peon position. also, yes it was very widely known about his drinking problem. it was released a week or so before the election and he lost a 3-4 polling points b/c of it. since the war on terror it's largely been forgotten. we haven't seen him appear to have been drinking at all since well, ever as far as i can recall.

and this actually goes to somewhat prove my point. i assure you that many republicans didn't think this was relavant but you see the need for hte public to hear about it and decide. as with the case of the vietnam vets about kerry.


in a side note i really do not see why he is hammering so much about his vietnam expirence. he was only there for like 4 months at most. that's like a fraction of a fraction of his life. if he had spent a year there at least i would see the point more. in my admittedly non-kerry opinion it's b/c he doesn't have a strong voting record to stand on. he voted to decrease funds for the intelligence agency's and then voted for the war on iraq but then against funding it. not something you really want to highlight is it?

ceilirose

Whether Kennedy has a drinking problem or had one is totally irrelevant to whether Bush has or had one. I sincerely doubt that the reason the Kerry campaign hasn't brought it up is because of some sort of backlash against Kennedy. Not unless we start brining up Republicans who have or have had some sort of substance abuse problems.

John Kerry served two tours of duty in Vietnam and not just four months. To get the correct facts on him all you have to do is go to johnkerry.com.

As far as the funding goes - Kerry wanted the $87 billion dollars to be accounted for by rolling back tax refunds to the wealthy..the Kerry-Biden amendment was the Democratic version for the funding. The bill that passed was the Republican version which just added $87 billion more onto the deficit. Kerry voted against the Republican version because he wanted more fiscal responsibility.

IIRC, if the Democratic version had passed then Bush would have vetoed it. I would have loved to have seen Bush's explanation for that one.

It's complicated and Kerry's campaign could explain it better than they do rather then let Bush own this issue.

n e r b l e

how does kennedy's killing a woman not matter in light of bush's issue? i'm just wondering how it's a-ok for a senator but not a president.

and let me clarify. he only spent 4 combat months in vietnam. the first tour was on a boat out to sea away from most of the combat.


so you're saying that bush would have vetoed a bill that would have rolled back the tax cuts he worked to hard to enact. gee i'm shocked.