News & Politics - U.S. Army extends Iraq duty for 4,000

Lexis · 09-25-2006, 10:27 AM

Quote:

In a new sign of mounting strain from the war in
Iraq, the Army has extended the combat tours of about 4,000 soldiers who would otherwise be returning home, defense officials said Monday.
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The 1st Brigade of 1st Armored Division, which is operating in the vicinity of Ramadi, the capital of Anbar province, will be kept in place for several weeks beyond its scheduled departure, the officials said. The officials spoke only on condition of anonymity because the decision has not been formally announced by the
Pentagon.

The brigade's home base is in Germany. The soldiers' families were notified on Monday that instead of going home in early January as scheduled, the brigade would be kept in Iraq until February — an extension of about six weeks, one of the officials said. Army officials also have notified members of Congress.

The brigade has about 4,000 soldiers in Iraq. They are not the first to be extended.

In late July the Army extended the Iraq tour of the Alaska-based 172nd Stryker Brigade. About 300 soldiers from that unit had already returned home and were required to go back to Iraq. The brigade is now operating in Baghdad.

The reasons for these extensions are different, but they both reflect the fact that the Army is hard pressed now to maintain rotations for Iraq and
Afghanistan at the current pace. The 172nd was extended by four months in order to strengthen U.S. forces in Baghdad, where commanders are trying to avert a full-scale civil war.

The 1st Brigade of the 1st Armored Division was extended in order to allow its replacement unit, the 1st Brigade of the 3rd Infantry Division, a minimum 12 months between overseas tours, the official said. The 3rd Infantry has already served two tours in Iraq, including the initial invasion of the country in March 2003.

Last week, the top American commander in the region said the U.S. military is likely to maintain and may even increase its force of more than 140,000 troops in Iraq through next spring. Gen. John Abizaid, commander of the U.S. Central Command, said military leaders would consider adding troops or extending the Iraq deployments of other units if needed.

Until sectarian violence spiked early this year, Bush administration officials had voiced hopes that this election year would see significant U.S. troop reductions in what has become a widely unpopular war.

The Army has a stated goal of giving active-duty soldiers two years at home between overseas combat tours, but it is unable to achieve that "dwell time," as the Army calls, because it does not have enough brigades to meet the demands of simultaneous wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. It would not be a problem now if the situation in Iraq had improved enough to allow the Army to reduce its presence as originally planned.

Army Secretary Francis Harvey told The Associated Press last week that the amount of time between deployments has shrunk this year from 18 months to 14 months. In the case of the 3rd Infantry, it appears at least one brigade will get only about 12 months because it is heading for Iraq to replace the extended brigade of the 1st Armored.

U.S. Army extends Iraq duty for 4,000 - Yahoo! News

If only the Iraqi army was ready to take on more security responsability. Its such a long time for these soldiers to be away, especially if they have little kids.

**TheAngel** · 09-25-2006, 05:17 PM

I really feel sorry for the men and women in the armed forces. But then again, in two and a half years I'll be one of them so I guess I'll be doing the same thing. The problem with the Iraqi army is that there's no loyalty. Even though most people in the US would complain if they were forced to fight, because of their sense of duty and loyalty to their country, many would fight. It's not that case in Iraq. There was a TV report several months ago that many men would volunteer and then as soon as they got paid they would desert.

Lexis · 09-26-2006, 02:17 AM

I hope the situation is miles better by the time you join up.

**TheAngel** · 09-26-2006, 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lexis (View Post)

I hope the situation is miles better by the time you join up.

Whether it is or not I'll do my job. Those that have come before me have kept me and my country safe for generations. My grandfather was in Italy during WWII, my uncle was stationed in Germany for two years, and my father would have joined the air force but he was def in one ear so he wasn't accepted. Now it's my turn to carry the torch, not as family tradition, but for the country that I love, even though I might not always agree with the actions of her leaders.

chicah · 09-26-2006, 07:17 AM

I've never really understood the US soldier patriotism... I guess that's just because I'm not used to people being proud of having relatives that are murderers. (No offense TheAngel, but I just can't see that.)

Lexis · 09-26-2006, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAngel (View Post)

Whether it is or not I'll do my job. Those that have come before me have kept me and my country safe for generations. My grandfather was in Italy during WWII, my uncle was stationed in Germany for two years, and my father would have joined the air force but he was def in one ear so he wasn't accepted. Now it's my turn to carry the torch, not as family tradition, but for the country that I love, even though I might not always agree with the actions of her leaders.

You said that so beautifully. Really, I find that extremely touching and I wish you all the best.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicah (View Post)

I've never really understood the US soldier patriotism... I guess that's just because I'm not used to people being proud of having relatives that are murderers. (No offense TheAngel, but I just can't see that.)

Firstly, its not just US soldiers and their families that are patriotic. Most nations around the world honour and respect their military for the sacrafice they make in order to protect their people. Members of my family served with the military with great pride and none of them are American. I am proud of them and proud to know that they stepped up to defend their country.

Maybe TheAngel won't take offense at your choice of words - but I do. Although soldiers are prepared to and do kill, I don't think the word murderer is appropriate to describe their actions. When a person kills an intruder in their home, I think that's self defense. When a soldier kills to protect their country, their comrades or innocent people, I think that is defense of those things, not murder.

To me, murderers are the cowards who fly planes into buildings and kill innocent people going to work or at the market.

WalkingOnSunshine · 09-26-2006, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicah (View Post)

I've never really understood the US soldier patriotism... I guess that's just because I'm not used to people being proud of having relatives that are murderers. (No offense TheAngel, but I just can't see that.)

I have no idea where you live, but I am guessing it is not in the US? However, I am assuming you are safe and wondering if that is because of your country's military. If it is - then you should be thankful and not so quick to label people who are fighting to give you the right to say such things.

ceilirose · 09-26-2006, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicah (View Post)

I've never really understood the US soldier patriotism... I guess that's just because I'm not used to people being proud of having relatives that are murderers. (No offense TheAngel, but I just can't see that.)

Come on now..that's too much of a generalization. Nothing's black and white in this world even though people try to portray it like that.

Have you ever spoken to currrent veterans of the Iraqi and Afghanistan wars and talked to them about their feeling, their duties, how they feel as they do? How about Vietnam vets? How about veterans of World War II?

You do a diservice to all who have served everywhere in any country when you come out with statements like that.

**TheAngel** · 09-26-2006, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicah (View Post)

I've never really understood the US soldier patriotism... I guess that's just because I'm not used to people being proud of having relatives that are murderers. (No offense TheAngel, but I just can't see that.)

I can't imagine why I'd find offense to that statement

You saying that makes me think of a quote from John Stuart Mills, and I hope he doesn't mind me borrowing his words for this situation.
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded
state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is
much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable
creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the
exertions of better men than himself."

I can assume that you live in a country that has a military, and I can assume that your military has had occasion to fight, whether defensive or offensive. I feel sorry for the men that are defending your right to call them murderers.

Lexis · 09-26-2006, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAngel (View Post)

You saying that makes me think of a quote from John Stuart Mills, and I hope he doesn't mind me borrowing his words for this situation.
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded
state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is
much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable
creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the
exertions of better men than himself."

That's a beautiful quote.

elisheva · 09-30-2006, 07:40 PM

That's a great quote, TheAngel. War is awful, but sometimes the alternative is worse.
We do have to be careful that we only go to war for the right reasons and in the right way, though, and that's where the debate comes in, chicah.

I don't think it's very fair to characterize Iraqi soldiers as disloyal or less brave than American soliders in Iraq, though. I don't want to get all relativist here, since that's not a philosophy I can agree with, but I do think it's important to remember that entirely different questions of culture and identity are at play there.

**TheAngel** · 10-01-2006, 06:05 AM

The thing is, and ask many soldiers to get into this deeply, we don't fight for washington or DC or some fat guy behind a desk. We, I anyway, fight for my brothers and sisters that are already over there. We have to do what our CO's tell us, but we fight for each other, for our friends and family back home. If I go to Iraq, I'm not fighting for Bush's agenda, I'm fighting for my friends that are already there, because what I do may in some small way help save a life of a friend and that is more important than anything else I do.
And so do the people of Iraq and the soldiers that want a unified country, whether a democracy or not, it doesn't matter. Any soldier is brave, nazi soldiers in WWII were brave, but history doesn't determine who was brave, or who was morally right or wrong, merely who's left, who won. That's what matters. And intend on being left. I'm not ready to die yet.


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