News & Politics - "That's so gay!" prompts a lawsuit

Lain · 03-02-2007, 03:43 AM

Article source: Link

I'd like to know what you're two cents are on this:

Quote:

‘That’s so gay’ prompts student lawsuit
Student sent to principal’s office insists it was not a homophobic putdown
The Associated Press
Updated: 4:41 p.m. HT Feb 28, 2007

SANTA ROSA, Calif. - When a few classmates razzed Rebekah Rice about her Mormon upbringing with questions such as, "Do you have 10 moms?" she shot back: "That's so gay."

Those three words landed the high school freshman in the principal's office and resulted in a lawsuit that raises this question: When do playground insults used every day all over America cross the line into hate speech that must be stamped out?

After Rice got a warning and a notation in her file, her parents sued, claiming officials at Santa Rosa's Maria Carillo High violated their daughter's First Amendment rights when they disciplined her for uttering a phrase "which enjoys widespread currency in youth culture," according to court documents.

Testifying last week about the 2002 incident, Rice, now 18, said that when she uttered those words, she was not referring to anyone's sexual orientation. She said the phrase meant: "That's so stupid, that's so silly, that's so dumb."

But school officials say they took a strict stand against the putdown after two boys were paid to beat up a gay student the year before.

"The district has a statutory duty to protect gay students from harassment," the district's lawyers argued in a legal brief. "In furtherance of this goal, prohibition of the phrase 'That's so gay' ... was a reasonable regulation."

Superior Court Judge Elaine Rushing plans to issue a ruling in the non-jury trial after final written arguments are submitted in April. Her gag order prevents the two sides from discussing the case.

A confusing set of terms
Derogatory terms for homosexuality have long been used as insults. But the landscape has become confusing in recent years as minority groups have tried to reclaim terms like "queer," "ghetto" and the n-word.

In recent years, gay rights advocates and educators have tried teaching students that it is hurtful to use the word "gay" as an all-purpose term for something disagreeable. At Berkeley High School, a gay student club passed out buttons with the words "That's so gay" crossed out to get their classmates to stop using them.

Rick Ayers, a retired teacher who helped compile and publish the "Berkeley High School Slang Dictionary," a compendium of trendy teen talk circa 2001, said educating students about offensive language is preferable to policing their speech.

"I wouldn't be surprised if this girl didn't even know the origin of that term," he said. "The kids who get caught saying it will claim it's been decontextualized, but others will say, `No, you know what that means.' It's quite talked about."

Rice's parents, Elden and Katherine Rice, also claim the public high school employed a double-standard because, they say, administrators never sought to shield Rebekah from teasing based on Mormon stereotypes.

Daughter singled out, parents say
In addition, the Rices say their daughter was singled out because of the family's conservative views on sexuality. They are seeking unspecified damages and want the disciplinary notation expunged from Rebekah's school record.

Eliza Byard, deputy executive director of the New York-based Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network, said nearly nine out of 10 gay students her organization surveyed in 2005 reported hearing "That's so gay" or "You're so gay" frequently.

"It bothers them a lot," Byard said. "As odd or funny as the phrase sounds, imagine what it feels like to be in a setting where you consistently hear it used to describe something undesirable or stupid, and it also refers to you."

She said it is OK to discipline students for using the phrase after efforts have been made to educate them.

"The job of a school is to deal proactively and consistently with all forms of bullying, name-calling and harassment," she said.

Jordan Lorence, an attorney with the Alliance Defense Fund, a Christian legal organization, agreed "That's so gay" carries a negative meaning and said he would not want his children to say it. But he said formal discipline is not the answer.

"Reasonable people should say, `Let's put a stop to this kind of search-and-destroy mission by school officials for everything that is politically incorrect,'" he said.

On one hand, people these days tend to use that phrase as a slang term. On the other hand, one could interpret as something offensive.

elisheva · 03-02-2007, 05:37 AM

It's a slang term, but it's a highly offensive one. I hate it, honestly. And yet - everyone uses it! Even people who would consider themselves open-minded, because they just don't think about what it implies.

I think it makes sense for this school to be strict about it, given the context:

Quote:

But school officials say they took a strict stand against the putdown after two boys were paid to beat up a gay student the year before.

"The district has a statutory duty to protect gay students from harassment," the district's lawyers argued in a legal brief. "In furtherance of this goal, prohibition of the phrase 'That's so gay' ... was a reasonable regulation."

I think her parents suing the school is ridiculous. I mean, seriously - she didn't even get detention, she was warned and a note was put in her file. The school must have hoped it would make her aware that "harmless" words have meaning - but apparently schools can never discipline students when students break school rules

Some people just get more defensive and self-righteous when told they've done something wrong, and I think that's an issue here. I mean, you can take issue with the severity of a punishment, of course, but to make a case based on the fact that it's okay to make offensive statements regularly, because it's common in popular culture? Come on.

The school should teach its students about the Mormon religion as well, so this girl doesn't get mocked because of popular stereotypes, though.

Indian Summer · 03-02-2007, 06:44 AM

I've flipped out on a gay boy for using that very term, but that's a long story. The short version is that he was in that whiny group (and I mean whiny- I'm all for people who stand up for your rights, but there's a difference between pointing out that you don't enjoy the same civic liberties as others and... ugh, I don't even want to think about it, lol) who was always complaining about how gays weren't treated fairly (the killer here? He's from the Netherlands, just outside of Amsterdam!) and then one day I was complaining about this moron who stole layouts from me and he replied "That's so gay!" Needless to say, I kicked him in the ass (erm, figuratively, of course) and told him that for all his whining, he sure had an odd way of showing how he wanted equality...

Anyway, I'm getting off topic. The point is, I hate that term. I hate when people use it, especially those who follow it up by saying "I was just joking" or "No, really, I love the gays" or something dumb like that.

But a lawsuit? Ugh. I think it's incredibly hypocritical of the school, though, to let the kids teasing her about her religion off while calling her in for this. The Church of Jesus Christ of LDS is a pretty misunderstood religion/movement since everyone seems to associate the followers with that one branch mostly in Utah. I don't see why it's alright to insult a minority religion but uttering anything against a minority group is wrong? You'd think they'd both be punished equally.

**sunnykerr** · 03-02-2007, 08:15 AM

A lawsuit is stupid. Hate speech is not covered by the first amendment. And, even though the words individually may not be intrinsically hateful, in this context this was hate speech.

The school was well within its rights to act against it. Not to mention that we're always picking on schools for not doing anything about bullying. But, when they do intervene, they get lawsuits???

~*katinthehat*~ · 03-02-2007, 08:40 AM

i do not like the saying "that's so gay." Because frankly how can an object be gay, aka this girl in my math class says " Math is gay." Math can not be gay. It's rude to say. I think a lawsuit is unnessary. Schools are trying to protect their students, FINALLY.

hadasuli · 03-02-2007, 08:59 AM

I think getting her to the principle is unnecessery, because, well it is a used phrase. A warning would be good if it's her first time, especially since she was a freshman and probably didn't know about the school's strict policy regarding this. If someone should really be punished in this story is the ones who teased her in the first place. They obviously meant to tourment her. About the lawsuit in my opinion it's also pointless because it's nothing serious, not even a detention, so...

However, I do find it offensive. I hear it alot too, and I hate it. It's good that schools do something to stop students from using that phrase.

Indian Summer · 03-02-2007, 09:00 AM

While I think it's definitely wrong to say it, I don't know if you can call the comment a hate speech in this context. I mean, it's insulting to the gay population, obviously, but it wasn't actually targetted at them. The "hate" is targetted at a comment that's offensive to the girl's religion, and I'd hardly call an offhand comment made by a dumb adolescent over a comment a hate speech. Morally ambiguous, sure.

**sunnykerr** · 03-02-2007, 09:58 AM

Allow me to rephrase. When that particular expression was thrown at me when I was in high school, I didn't particularly feel like someone was extending their friendship to me. Which is why I'm saying good on the principal for intervening. Of course, that doesn't address the fact that the girl who threw that out was herself being harassed when she did so. To me, that's where the problem is.

It's that culture of diminishing people for who they are that I find highly hateful and objectionable. Yes, it's probably a natural part of high school, but it doesn't mean that adults who know better and are suppose to guide these kids through this difficult period in their lives should stand on the sidelines and do nothing. And, when they do nothing, especially at that age where we all test our limits, I feel they are... I don't want to say encouraging, and I don't want to say agreeing either... but they're allowing this thing to fester.

Bullying isn't just punches thrown and lunch money stolen.

At my high school, we didn't have a uniform, but we had a lot of rules. Couldn't have "rage against the machine" T-shirts. No sleeveless anything was allowed. Skirts and shorts had to go to the knees. Nothing ripped. Nothing with flames on it. No curse words on clothing. Girls with developed breasts had to wear some sort of support underwear. No shoes unlaced. No boots with metal on them. And so on.

Now, if we're gonna do all of that, why not say, "And these are the words and expressions that will not be tolerated?..."

migamoo · 03-02-2007, 11:36 AM

I do not think anyone is right in this. The boys should have never teased her and she should never have said the phrase. I understand the school's reaction, especially after a gay student was abused but I do have to agree with the parents about the school not doing anything about the girl being teased. But as far as this going to a lawsuit, I just think that it is unbelievable. Why sue? It's not like the girl was kicked out of the school or failed because of her words.

rose parade · 03-02-2007, 05:57 PM

I don't even understand how "that's so gay" came about anyway. I hate it. It's just weird that people actually say it. It's just...bizzare, I don't know. I don't think anyone would ever say "that's so straight!" or "that's soo bisexual!"

migamoo · 03-02-2007, 06:02 PM

I don't know how it came about either, but you are right. No one would ever say those things. But, looking at it in that context, you can almost see how it might have come about.

pacifierrocks · 03-03-2007, 01:50 AM

I get why she got sent to the principles office for that, but I think that the classmates who were going on about her religion should also have gotten in trouble if she was. If what they were doing was trying to show that intolerance for someone's lifestyle was not going to be tolerated at the school then they should've given her religion the same respect.

I do think that the lawsuit is a bit much though. She didn't even really get punished for it. I got in more trouble when I was in high school for being late to class. Like two steps away from the door and I had to come into school on the weekend for detention. She just got a note in her file!!!

xXGirlXx · 03-03-2007, 02:28 AM

I use the pharse "That's so straight" sometimes when I'm frustrated. I've developed my own new slang meaning, straight means now f***ed up, among all the other things too

No offence should be taken.

hadasuli · 03-03-2007, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunnykerr (View Post)

Now, if we're gonna do all of that, why not say, "And these are the words and expressions that will not be tolerated?..."

That's what they do at my school. And it actually works. But they don't send people to the principle for it. Though you could get sent out of the class.

And 'that's so straight'- lol!

Jacob1983 · 03-03-2007, 11:50 PM

I could not resist posting on this. I know I said I quit for now but I guess you can call me a flip flopper or liar. Anyways, it is wrong to call someone an anti-gay slur. However, this girl had a legitimate reason to use the term "that's so gay". She was clearly defending herself from a personal attack. Besides, let's face the word "gay" historically has not always meant homosexual. It has had other meanings. Back in the old days, it meant happy. We live in a society where the slang rules and proper grammar and etiquette are dormant.
If you are going to file a lawsuit against a person who uses the term "that's so gay" then why not file one against people who say "my bad".
I'll admit that I use the term "that's gay or that's so gay" but never in a derogatory way against homosexuals. When I say it, I am intending to say that something isn't cool or that it sucks. If you fined the writers of South Park for everytime their cartoon characters said "that's so gay or that's gay", you would be rich.

The word "straight" is used in a few slang terms such as "scared straight" or "I'll straighten you out".
I think this lawsuit is ridiculous and borderline insane in the membrane. Name calling is wrong and bad but people shouldn't be sued over it.


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