News & Politics - Bush proposes steep cuts in 2.57 TR Budget

last beautiful girl · 02-07-2005, 08:17 PM

Yahoo! News

What could you possibly do with 2 trillion dollars?

Quote:

Forty-eight education programs would be eliminated, including one for ridding drugs from schools.

Children need to be educated in drug prevention because in some cases, the parents don't sit down and say 'drugs are bad'. They should, but they don't. It should be a requirement in elementary/high schools. Especially high schools. The kids don't always listen, but at least have it there so it's an option.

Quote:

Chief among the targets would be Medicaid, the federal-state health insurance program for the poor and disabled, but farmers' payments, student loans and veterans medical services were also on the chopping block.

I'm not a hundred percent sure of this, but would chopping the farmers' payments effect the availability of fruit/vegetables, possibly making things(apples, peppers, cherries, etc) more expensive? I mean, they have to get paid somehow, so it would be logical to jack the prices up a bit. I work in a supermarket(not in the grocery/produce department, however), so I'm curious as to what that means. More than that, what about those that depend on farming for their livelyhood?

The student loans thing scares me. More often than not, people depend on student loans and work and go to classes at the same time. And if you don't, you're really blessed to have parents who worked their butts off so you could have an education and not have to worry about it.

I don't know about this.

mh67511 · 02-07-2005, 09:39 PM

I am split on the farming subsidies. Living in Nebraska that's a big issue because it definitely helps out the economy here. On the other hand, farming subsidies encourage overproduction and many times our surplus crops are sent to other countries like Mexico where our prices undercut those of the native farmers. Also I read that many of these subsidies don't even go to small family farms, which I have no problem helping, but the large farming organizations that buy up family farms.

I don't really know what to think of the cuts. I owed $100 in taxes last year and got an $800 Pell Grant and a subsidized Stafford Loan...so that's like an 800% return. Frankly I made out like a bandit last year!

I do think that the space program should be drastically cut. What has it provided us within the past 5 years? Has it improved our security? Has it improved our quality of life? What has it done? Right now it seems useless to me. Even if they are investigating technology, will the majority of us ever get to benefit from the technology they could potentially discover? Don't get me wrong, seeing pictures of Saturn is fascinating. But not when they come at a price tag of billions of dollars. This isn't Star Trek, this is reality. I mean come on...spending hundreds of millions, if not a billion+ to fix the Hubble telescope? A FREAKING TELESCOPE? Give me a *****ing break.

I also think they should raise the SS retirement age very soon. That would probably save quite a bit of money, at least in the short term.

mh67511 · 02-07-2005, 10:20 PM

Really interesting article from MSNBC. I just posted the main points, but they go more into depth.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6910217/

Quote:

Ten things to know about the federal budget

1. The document that President Bush submits to Congress on Monday is only the beginning of a long budget-making process.

2. How one measures spending, revenues and deficits makes all the difference.

3. Federal spending, although bigger in nominal terms than it was 40 years ago, has remained within a fairly narrow range, when measured as a percentage of GDP.

4. Since Sept. 11, 2001, military outlays have increased sharply — and almost as importantly, they have muddled the regular budget process.

5. The federal government spends far less on the military than it did in John Kennedy’s presidency.

6. The entitlements programs, principally Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security, are inexorably becoming a bigger proportion of federal spending.

7. The growth in the entitlements programs means that discretionary outlays for items such as national parks, AIDS prevention, etc. keep shrinking as a percentage of total spending.

8. Changes in tax rates and the mix of the various taxes — on income, on capital gains, on inherited wealth, etc. — have made only a modest difference in how much revenue the government has collected over the long haul.

9. The United States government borrows money from lenders in Japan, China and other countries to pay for its current outlays. Some members of Congress see this as a risky practice.

10. The deficit is an imperfect measure of the government’s fiscal position.

MalloryKeaton · 02-07-2005, 11:21 PM

quote: that would erase scores of programs and slice Medicaid, disabled housing and many more but still worsen federal deficits by $42 billion over the next five years.

I think that's awful that he wants to cut Medicaid and disabiled housing. Invdividuals that need such programs are only going to suffer without them. The fact that by eliminating and/or severely reducing these programs would worsen the budget how does he think that makes sense or can possibly justify taking these programs away?

quote: Forty-eight education programs would be eliminated.

Eliminating or drastically slashing educational problems is going to be a major downfall. Children need education. We can't expect future generations to do well if he takes so many education programs away. I don't see any way to justify getting rid of edcuational programs.

quote: Chief among the targets would be Medicaid, the federal-state health insurance program for the poor and disabled,

Doesn't he realize that these individuals cannot afford health care insurance for one reason or another? How does he expect these indivdiuals to live, or at least stay healthly, if their heath insurance is taken away?

quote: "The taxpayers of America don't want us spending our money into something that's not achieving results."

The programs and services he wants to reduce or get rid of get results.

quote: "a blueprint to fund our nation's priorities"

He doesn't consider the programs a priority? I guess it's going to be at the "cost" of so many people. I think it's a terrible "price" to have to pay.

quote:Bush was using some of his budget cuts to funnel billions to White House priorities.

I hope that doesn't mean that the money will go into maintaining the White House and extravagant luxaries that he may want. It seems like unless it affects him directly it's not important. If he were to suddenly need Medicaid, disabled housing, Medicare, education programs, etc. he might come to a vastly different decision as to how to handle the budget and exactly what to cut. He might then feel that the "non-priorities" as he puts it are infact important.

quote :to encourage low-income people to buy health insurance.

If they can't afford it now, what makes him think they're going to suddenly be able to buy insurance later on?

last beautiful girl · 02-08-2005, 11:03 AM

Taken from the article:

Quote:

Bush was expected to propose an $81 billion war package for the rest of 2005 in a few days.

And then he says:

Quote:

A blueprint to fund our nation's priorities

So war is a priority? I'd feel a little bit better if he'd said "defense package", but he didn't. Education, health care, social security, student loans...those aren't priorities?

ceilirose · 02-08-2005, 11:20 AM

This budget proposal doesn't even have the appropriations for the Iraq and Afghanistan Wars or the 2 trillion needed to change Social Security to private accounts.

ITA with Mallory Keaton..the issue to urge low income people to buy health insurance but to come up with low cost health insurance that people can afford.

It's getting a little tiresome to hear US Senators tell us that hard decisions need to be made to deal with the deficit (ie..programs for the disadvantaged being cut) while everyone needs to get their tax cuts.

mh67511 · 02-08-2005, 12:26 PM

In the United States it is becoming very clear that our two priorities are (1) The Elderly and (2) Defense. Notice how there were no cuts in Social Security, Medicare, or Defense.

Milt Palacio · 02-08-2005, 12:56 PM

Starve the beast, baby.

alli balli · 02-08-2005, 01:14 PM

Maybe he wouldn't have to make so many cuts if he'd actually TAX PEOPLE!!!

I'm sorry, I just don't get it. IMO if you expect your government to run itself well and do things for you, you're going to have to help pay for it. In what universe does it make sense to start spending trillions of dollars "liberating" foreign countries, and simultaneously give tax breaks?

last beautiful girl · 02-08-2005, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Celli said:

This budget proposal doesn't even have the appropriations for the Iraq and Afghanistan Wars

So the 'war budget' isn't included. Pardon my rant in my last post then.

mh67511 · 02-09-2005, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by last beautiful girl

What could you possibly do with 2 trillion dollars? (

Quite a bit actually. Especially in the United States where we have this concept of "entitlement."

Milt Palacio · 02-09-2005, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh67511

Quite a bit actually. Especially in the United States where we have this concept of "entitlement."

Explain.

mh67511 · 02-09-2005, 11:41 AM

Simple, people in this country feel they are entitled to many things.

"Everybody else is..."
"They all have..."

Some examples of entitlements in our country:
- A farmer feels entitled to get farm subsidies.
- A college student feels entitled to get financial aid.
- A single mom feels entitled to get welfare.
- A low-income family feels entitled to get food stamps.
- A large donor to a charity feels entitled to a tax deduction.
- An elderly person feels entitled to get Social Security and Medicare.

I suppose you could replace feel with are. The list goes on and on. I'm not saying that I don't feel that way, because I certainly do and have at times. But that doesn't mean it's a healthy way of thinking though, because I don't think it is.

All of these entitlement programs add up. I'm not saying they are good or bad. Many entitlement programs are very good and important. I am just saying that the more you offer people the more it costs.

http://www.sideroad.com/Personal_Dev...titlement.html

That's a good article on what sense of entitlement is all about.

Lexis · 02-09-2005, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh67511

Simple, people in this country feel they are entitled to many things.

"Everybody else is..."
"They all have..."

Some examples of entitlements in our country:
- A farmer feels entitled to get farm subsidies.
- A college student feels entitled to get financial aid.
- A single mom feels entitled to get welfare.
- A low-income family feels entitled to get food stamps.
- A large donor to a charity feels entitled to a tax deduction.
- An elderly person feels entitled to get Social Security and Medicare.

I suppose you could replace feel with are. The list goes on and on. I'm not saying that I don't feel that way, because I certainly do and have at times. But that doesn't mean it's a healthy way of thinking though, because I don't think it is.

All of these entitlement programs add up. I'm not saying they are good or bad. Many entitlement programs are very good and important. I am just saying that the more you offer people the more it costs.

http://www.sideroad.com/Personal_Dev...titlement.html

That's a good article on what sense of entitlement is all about.

Hmmm....see, I believe we are all entitled to the support we need to live and to better ourselves. Therefore, I don't see why it is bad to feel that we deserve those things.

The example in the article of the mother and son obviously shows the sons selfish sense of entitlement, something unhealthy. I also think that Bush's decision to cut programmes in education, military benefits (not for defense spending but for the soldiers themselves), housing and healthcare is disgusting becauses he seems to believe that the rich are entitled to huge tax cuts and that abstinance only sex education programmes (that have poor records and as a recent study showed, many actually lie) deserve an increase of $39 million.

ceilirose · 02-09-2005, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by last beautiful girl

So the 'war budget' isn't included. Pardon my rant in my last post then.

No unfortunately those are all over and above the 2006 budget just published. I heard on the radio that they're proposing to cut subsidies to low income people for heat in the winter, ending childhood obesity programs, cutting aid to first responders and ending programs that help underpriveliged kids with average grades get scholarships to college and to work toward improving their grades.

Like Lexis said the abstinence programs (sex education) are getting an increase. Whew..what a relief, huh?


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