News & Politics - Abortion bill passes in ND

++Audrina++ · 02-18-2009, 11:02 AM

Quote:

North Dakota House Gives Fertilized Eggs Human Status
The measure that would make it all but impossible to get an abortion in the state now goes to the North Dakota Senate after the state House.

. -- A measure approved by the North Dakota House gives a fertilized human egg the legal rights of a human being, a step that would essentially ban abortion in the state.

The bill is a direct challenge to Roe v. Wade, the U.S. Supreme Court decision that extended abortion rights nationwide, supporters of the legislation said.

Representatives voted 51-41 to approve the measure Tuesday. It now moves to the North Dakota Senate for its review.

The bill declares that "any organism with the genome of homo sapiens" is a person protected by rights granted by the North Dakota Constitution and state laws.

The measure's sponsor, Rep. Dan Ruby, R-Minot, said the legislation did not automatically ban abortion. Ruby has introduced bills in previous sessions of the Legislature to prohibit abortion in North Dakota.

"This language is not as aggressive as the direct ban legislation that I've proposed in the past," Ruby said during House floor debate on Tuesday. "This is very simply defining when life begins, and giving that life some protections under our Constitution — the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Critics of the measure say it will cost millions of dollars to defend. Ruby said the state has been willing to go to bat for other principles that were less important.

In Oklahoma, meanwhile, a state House committee Tuesday approved legislation that would prohibit physicians from performing abortions solely on account of the gender of a woman's fetus, even though the measure's author said there is no evidence the practice has ever occurred in the state.

The legislation passed 20-2 by the House Public Health Committee. The bill now goes to the full House for consideration.

The author of the bill, Rep. Dan Sullivan, R-Tulsa, said it is designed to stop couples from using the gender of a fetus as a reason to get an abortion. Sullivan said a doctor would be prohibited from performing an abortion if the mother specifically said the fetus' sex was the reason.

However, he said there is no evidence the practice has occurred in Oklahoma. "I haven't received any definite information that proves it," Sullivan said.

foxnews.com

**sunnykerr** · 02-18-2009, 04:31 PM

Here's the full link to the story: North Dakota House Gives Fertilized Eggs Human Status - Presidential Politics | Political News - FOXNews.com

And, seriously? Seriously? What century is this?

Gah. This is insane. Don't they realize that the only thing that legislation could or would possibly accomplish is to bring back the "death by abortion" statistics of before Roe v. Wade?

That's assuming it passes, which hopefully it won't.

But, seriously, you make abortion illegal, all you're doing is making it more dangerous for women who can't afford to travel to where it is legal. Because abortion has been going on since the dawn of time. The only thing that changes when it is legalized, it that you guaranteed a safe and sanitary procedure. That's the only difference between legalizing abortion and prohibiting it.

This is preposterous.

ceilirose · 02-18-2009, 04:51 PM

Are these legislatures doing anything about the homeless, those without health care, the jobless etc., etc.?

Or is it telling people - actually just women - what they can do with their bodies? Because really - that's so important. Can we also legislate when men should have vasectomies? I think we need that too.

I'm hoping it doesn't pass at all.

**sunnykerr** · 02-18-2009, 05:44 PM

I honestly can't see how it can pass. I don't know what's under federal purview and what is under the states's purview, but you can't ban abortion in one state, can you? I mean, it would make no sense.

And, seriously, an absolute prohibition on abortion is, itself, criminal. It doesn't take into account cases where the mother's health may be in jeopardy (never mind that, for most of the pregnancy, the mother's death would provoke the fetus's death as well).

I can't believe it's even taken seriously in a democratic country. It's a travesty.

**Cristofle** · 02-18-2009, 06:13 PM

This can't pass while Roe v. Wade stands. It's a direct challenge to it, as the article says.

**sunnykerr** · 02-18-2009, 06:43 PM

Well, that much is a relief.

But the fact that it would pass in the House. And the fact that it's considered a legitimate motion for a legislative body to study is utterly appalling.

Not in this day and age. Not in a democracy.

ceilirose · 02-18-2009, 07:01 PM

Well they might be able to pass it but whether it could stand a challenge with Roe V. Wade still the law of the land is doubtful. Like the article said - the challenges would cost millions and what state in the country has excess money? Now it could come from wealthy pro-life backers so who knows. There have been limitations put on late term abortions and the SC has upheld it along with Congress.

**Cristofle** · 02-18-2009, 07:06 PM

I'm just relieved to have a President in the White House who cares about a woman's right to choose again. This kind of thing is utterly ridiculous and out of touch with the country at large, 75% of which do not believe Roe v. Wade should be overturned. It's also out of touch with our national laws and a waste of time trying to pass through in a time when our country is in crisis. And of course, it would lead to very dangerous consequences if enforced, as mentioned above. Abortions wouldn't stop because they were illegal- the women would just die too, because the surgeries would become so dangerous. It's been proven when abortion WAS illegal. This is not the way to lower the abortion rate- education about safe sex is.

**TheAngel** · 02-19-2009, 09:41 AM

Alright, so if they're going to do this are they going to make it illegal to smoke and drink during pregnancy too? Because I actually have no problems with that (making it illegal to smoke and drink during pregnancy) but if a few cells are given the same rights as living babies then they're obviously underage. I can't help it, this is just ludicrous.

Bella Grint · 02-19-2009, 10:51 AM

You see, if ND passes this I also hope they pass stronger regulations on other things as well, such as adoption, foster care, welfare, etc. Because if women have no way out either way (even in rape if I am correct) they might as well provide the best options. I doubt birth control is popular in ND but the more women protected the less chance of abortions. I hope this doesn't pass but it wouldn't surprise me sadly. I mean, these same people who want to pass this abortion bill probably look down on welfare and encourage adoption and such but it's not as easy as it sounds. Unemployed women with many kids on welfare might become more common in ND. The foster care system is a joke in my opinion for this country as well.

**sunnykerr** · 02-19-2009, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cristofle (View Post)

This kind of thing is utterly ridiculous and out of touch with the country at large, 75% of which do not believe Roe v. Wade should be overturned.

The thing of it is, though, unless people start en masse to become massively less apathetic in terms of voting and not letting their leaders get away with crap like this, this really is an appalling sign of the state of things...

It's people at the extremes of the spectrum of have more of a voice, because they're the ones who show up. They're also the ones more like to make a fuss about this kind of stuff.

I must say, it's also a sign of this sickness in American politics of only equating values with "family values", which is then equated with "religious values". I don't know when it started, and I'm certainly not saying it's everywhere or that everyone feels the same way (though, once again, people who show up to vote seem to be signicantly in this camp), but religion has become a part of American politics.

It's as though it's become too complicated for the masses (and I'm generalizing here, I know, but stick with me and then tell me if I'm out of line) to determine that their elected representatives are moral individuals UNLESS they can quickly identify their religious affliations.

It got worse under W, who instituted a ban on federal spending to organizations who taught the use of contraception in their family-planning endeavours, but it is bigger than the man.

Obviously, there is nothing wrong with being religious and with organizing one's life according to one's religious beliefs. But religion should not be a part of politics, no more than any other social institution anyway.

vc318 · 02-19-2009, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Obviously, there is nothing wrong with being religious and with organizing one's life according to one's religious beliefs. But religion should not be a part of politics, no more than any other social institution anyway.

Exactly - forcing one's beliefs on an entire group of people is entirely unfair. How about we improve sex education classes and counseling services for women who may feel that they have no other choice but to throw themselves down a flight of stairs when they feel utterly hopeless about what to do with an unwanted pregnancy?

**sunnykerr** · 02-20-2009, 02:13 PM

I seriously will never understand why the pro-life movement isn't getting behind a massive sex-ed drive in schools.

I mean, I understand it. Talking about safe sex means you have to go out right away and screw the next available warm body and all of that.

But, seriously, even I'm not naive enough to believe that kids and teenagers are all walking around out there with zero thoughts of having sex. Kids have sex. You can either talk to them about it or let them make their own mistakes. I know which strategy I'd prefer, but be that as it may, we should at least allow them to deal with the consequences of their actions on their own terms, whatever those may be.

Bella Grint · 02-20-2009, 02:15 PM

Does ND have anything being taught in their systems? Even only abstinence?

vc318 · 02-22-2009, 07:51 AM

With budget cuts, I be this was one of the first things that got trimmed down.


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