News & Politics - 2008 Presidential Election:(Part 10) Where We Debate the Debates! - Page 6

UnsilentMajorty · 10-08-2008, 05:09 PM

In my opinion, I think McCain actually LIKES Obama as a person... And this is why he can't (couldn't?) bring himself to take any pot shots regarding Bill Ayers during the debate. He could have slipped it in at ANY TIME, but he didn't... Because not only is bad politics, it is a meaningless attack with very little substance behind it that does nothing for either of them.

This is also why I think you guys are going around in circles regarding the "that one" line because all it was, IMO, was McCain trying to differentiate his voting record from Obamas.

As I stated before, I don't think McCain is qualified to be President for a number of reasons... But none of those reasons is because I think he is racist. At all. As stated, he has an adopted daughter and if he were to ever use race in this election it would devastate her. I think he has enough decency to realize this. He might be a unstable, "old man" and "out of touch", but that is with the bigger issues. I think he knows his family and knows if he ever used race negatively it would forever damage him and his adopted daughters relationship. I think even he is aware of this and why I think he might secretly be rooting for Obama even if he will never admit it.

Of course, this doesn't mean the campaign won't/can't use race and other vile attacks we've seen. However, my point is McCain is not his campaign... no pun intended... And this is what I think we have to remember about all of this. Campaign runners and staff are in this for one reason: To get their candidate elected. That's because they are a impersonal entity with a specific job to do. This is what THEY (the campaign staff) are judged on, so they have MORE at stake than even the candidate sometimes. Yes, they the candidate and their staff both want to win, but again, the campaign is NOT the candidate and vice versa.

This is also why I think McCain's campaign appears to BE so unorganized. It is like the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. I don't think McCain personally hates Obama, but the other part of his campaign is trying to send the exact opposite message with the terrorist, and Bill Ayers angle. It doesn't add up and from my perspective... Because a coordinated effort would be Palin killing him in the media and then McCain following up on TV in the debates, but that DID NOT happen... So, it looks like there might be some communication gaps apparent either on purpose, or just because of uncoordinated efforts. This is why McCain's campaign looks bi-polar these last few days...

ericfan1 · 10-08-2008, 05:41 PM

I think the reason that McCain did not mention the Bill Ayers angle is because he knows he would have been shot down by Obama because it is not true, Obama was only 8 years old when Ayers was doing his terrorist thing. I think that McCain and Palin know it is not true but are throwing it out there to try and presaude voters to not trust Obama. Merely, a suggestion to question his character. Sad to say, but there are many voters out there that will be presauded into believeing that it is true, and that they can not trust Obama. I have had discussions with people that swear that obama is a Muslim and is planted in this country to commit acts of terror against America. Far too many voters do not read what is written or follow debates but rely soley on what others tell them. Especially if they are being told what they want to hear.

ceilirose · 10-08-2008, 05:46 PM

Here's the latest from Obama in regards to Ayers and McCain:

ABC News: Obama: McCain Scoring 'Cheap Political Points'

Quote:

Sen. Barack Obama says the personal attacks levied against him by the campaign of his presidential rival, Sen. John McCain, particularly references to his association with 1960s anti-war radical Bill Ayers, are an attempt to "score cheap political points."

"Why don't we just clear it up right now," Obama told ABC News' Charlie Gibson in an exclusive interview for World News. "I'll repeat again what I've said many times. This is a guy who engaged in some despicable acts 40 years ago when I was eight years old. By the time I met him, 10 or 15 years ago, he was a college professor of education at the University of Illinois . . . And the notion that somehow he has been involved in my campaign, that he is an adviser of mine, that . . . I've 'palled around with a terrorist', all these statements are made simply to try to score cheap political points."

Obama said that the McCain campaign is making personal attacks "the centerpiece of the discussion in the closing weeks of a campaign where we are facing the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression and we're in the middle of two wars."

Obama said he believes the personal attacks are an attempt to "change the subject" and draw attention away from the issue at the front of most voters' minds: the struggling economy.

"I mean, you've had their spokespeople over the last couple of days say if we talk about the economic crisis, we lose. I mean, you can't be much more blatant than that," he said.

Obama also said he was surprised some of those attacks weren't brought up by his opponent at the debate Tuesday night at Belmont University in Nashville, Tenn.

"I am surprised that, you know, we've been seeing some pretty over-the-top attacks coming out of the McCain campaign over the last several days, that he wasn't willing to say it to my face. But I guess we've got one last debate. So presumably, if he ends up feeling that he needs to, he will raise it during the debate."

ericfan1 · 10-08-2008, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ceilirose (View Post)

Here's the latest from Obama in regards to Ayers and McCain:

ABC News: Obama: McCain Scoring 'Cheap Political Points'

Thanks for posting.. This is a good resonse from Obama. I am glad that he addressed it.

Bella Grint · 10-08-2008, 06:41 PM

I'm glad Obama talked about it too. And glad to know he won't be suprised if it's brought up at the last debate..he seems like he wants to face and take that attack down and no matter what McCain throws at him regarding Ayers Obama already knows it's coming.

ericfan1 · 10-08-2008, 06:59 PM

I would seriously doubt that McCain would bring it up to him face to face. He knows Obama would be able to address it and it would not make McCain look good.

collide · 10-08-2008, 07:14 PM

I think if he brings it up during the debates, he will look desperate. The Independents do not want to hear personal attacks. They want to hear solutions.

ceilirose · 10-08-2008, 07:21 PM

There seems to be a disconnect between the atmosphere at the McCain/Palin campaign stops and when either of them speak to the mainstream media.

Preaching to the choir is one thing and telling lies to someone else to their face is another. Also Obama has ammunition too on both of them. I don't think Obama wants to go that way however.

ericfan1 · 10-08-2008, 07:26 PM

I hate smear tactics in campaigning.

collide · 10-08-2008, 09:20 PM

If Obama wins, I am going to be so afraid of the crazies.

Although, I think it will be bad either way.

**Cristofle** · 10-09-2008, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnsilentMajorty (View Post)

In my opinion, I think McCain actually LIKES Obama as a person... And this is why he can't (couldn't?) bring himself to take any pot shots regarding Bill Ayers during the debate. He could have slipped it in at ANY TIME, but he didn't... Because not only is bad politics, it is a meaningless attack with very little substance behind it that does nothing for either of them.

This is also why I think you guys are going around in circles regarding the "that one" line because all it was, IMO, was McCain trying to differentiate his voting record from Obamas.

As I stated before, I don't think McCain is qualified to be President for a number of reasons... But none of those reasons is because I think he is racist. At all. As stated, he has an adopted daughter and if he were to ever use race in this election it would devastate her. I think he has enough decency to realize this. He might be a unstable, "old man" and "out of touch", but that is with the bigger issues. I think he knows his family and knows if he ever used race negatively it would forever damage him and his adopted daughters relationship. I think even he is aware of this and why I think he might secretly be rooting for Obama even if he will never admit it.

Of course, this doesn't mean the campaign won't/can't use race and other vile attacks we've seen. However, my point is McCain is not his campaign... no pun intended... And this is what I think we have to remember about all of this. Campaign runners and staff are in this for one reason: To get their candidate elected. That's because they are a impersonal entity with a specific job to do. This is what THEY (the campaign staff) are judged on, so they have MORE at stake than even the candidate sometimes. Yes, they the candidate and their staff both want to win, but again, the campaign is NOT the candidate and vice versa.

This is also why I think McCain's campaign appears to BE so unorganized. It is like the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. I don't think McCain personally hates Obama, but the other part of his campaign is trying to send the exact opposite message with the terrorist, and Bill Ayers angle. It doesn't add up and from my perspective... Because a coordinated effort would be Palin killing him in the media and then McCain following up on TV in the debates, but that DID NOT happen... So, it looks like there might be some communication gaps apparent either on purpose, or just because of uncoordinated efforts. This is why McCain's campaign looks bi-polar these last few days...

Oh, I don't. I don't give McCain this much credit. I think he pretty thoroughly LOATHES Obama. He feels Obama is taking what he rightfully deserves, and he's this young inexperienced guy who doesn't warrant it.

I don't think not putting in Bill Ayers had anything to do with respect for Obama. RESPECT would be to confront him face to face and give him a chance to explain, instead of gossiping like a third grade girl at rallies about it. I think he didn't mention Ayers because he'd been told by his people that it would be alienating. McCain's topics were not alienating- it was the way he just couldn't HELP but be rude and condescending and dismissive that ended up being alienating. I don't think it's a case of inner conflict between respect for Obama and a desire to win- I think that's giving McCain FAR too much credit. I think it's a conflict between what he's been told- and what he logically knows- will alienate people and his utter inability to control his temper.

collide · 10-09-2008, 11:34 AM

This video is adorable:
ontd_political: BEHIND THE SCENES at the DNC

ceilirose · 10-09-2008, 11:40 AM

If people remember 1996 and the Dole/Clinton race there is some similarities. Dole lost while all the time wondering why people weren't voting for him. I don't think he felt as entitled as McCain does but his race was run the same way. Dole wasn't as nasty as McCain though and didn't send his wife out as the attack dog like Cindy McCain did yesterday. That was not a pretty picture.

From what I've read Palin has dropped the Ayers connection in her speeches but will talk about it in her interviews. Also MSNBC said that she will only be talking to FOX News and local news outlets from now on. That's a safe move for her - not so great for the whole democratic process though.

Bella Grint · 10-09-2008, 11:43 AM

Yeah keep to people who will follow her every move no matter how crazy...like Fox news. Why wouldn't it be good for the Democratic news press? I think if she did say anything on any news outlet it'd come out anyway. And some Dems do watch Fox news. I think it's a good idea to see what the other side is saying.

What did Cindy McCain say? I haven't heard anything about Michelle or..??

collide · 10-09-2008, 11:53 AM

I think she should drop the Ayers thing in her speeches. She is inciting the crazies with that kind of talk.

Cindy said Obama has run the dirtiest campign in history......lol, what? Has she looked at her husband? Obama only fights back when McCain attacks him first.