eternalfate

atwoodsmariano

I actually really loved the scene where Oz showed Willow that he could control his wolf transformation during a full moon

also the scene which this thread title is based on

☆♥~Buffyverse_Lover16~♥☆

Their goodbye in Wild at Heart. Yours?

eternalfate

☆♥~Buffyverse_Lover16~♥☆

I think a part of her will always be waiting for him. I am sure of it. I don't think she turned out to be a full fledged lesbian after Oz left.

eternalfate

atwoodsmariano

they set her up liking girls starting in that S3 episode the wish so there were hints of what was going to happen in S4 but I do think she's ultimately bi but liking girls more in the later seasons but the thing with Kennedy was so unnecessary

starryeyesxx

I don't care how it was written, in my mind, she was bi

They didn't have the same understanding of sexuality as they do now - plus, so many different writers were involved in Willow's story, so I'd say that would all write her differently at different times. I doubt the people writing Willow in seasons 1-3 wrote Oz as a 'phase' to her, even if they knew that they might explore a lesbian storyline with her down the road. She didn't date & fall in love with Oz because of 'the evils of heteronomativity', it was real. She can say she's gay, but she's been attracted to & in love with men before, so I don't see why it would be impossible again even if 99% of the people she's attracted to are women

Anyway, I got off track

My fave season 4 scene is definitely the goodbye in his van, it was so heartbreaking because it was obvious there was still so much love there, & a little bit of hope for the future, even though they were parting.

eternalfate

eternalfate

starryeyesxx

I know Willow herself said she was gay - but she's fictional character, not a real person, so I think it's open to interpretation. Especially, as I said, so many people were involved with the portrayal of her character & they probably weren't always on the same page with what they were depicting.

I don't think saying that I view her as bisexual equates to saying that 'Willow was going crazy and she was in denial?' I just think that it's possible she realized that she was attracted to women, & took that to mean that she was gay. Besides, it's not uncommon for people to just say gay when what they mean is not straight.

I think this just pushes my buttons because a few weeks ago someone posted on one of my Willow/Oz gifsets about how Willow was always gay, but she was just flattered that Oz paid attention to her & she was brainwashed by heteronormativity, so that's why she was with him for two years. I don't care if that's what people believe - but why hijack my post with that? I've also seen people say seen people comment that it's 'disrespectful' to ship Willow with a man & I just can't

Anyway, I'm not changing my opinion. It's a tv show, & what I'm headcannoning isn't baseless, we did see Willow in romantic relationships with both a man & a woman.

eternalfate

Crystal Clear

Well, there's no need to feign confusion over this. Joss and Marti were trying to turn the show into something else entirely in the College years, and using Willow's character to do it. They were trying to force the acceptance of lesbianism onto us. Simple as that. No need to beat around the bush.


They went too far, in my opinion. It was made clear from the beginning that Willow's attraction to Tara had nothing to do with the fact that she was female. They had the loneliness and the witchcraft in common. Willow was completely lost after the Oz devastation. He left a huge void. No-one can ever tell me that their love wasn't real.


Honestly, I hated much of when Marti Noxon took over the Executive reigns of the show. She pushed Spike/Buffy so dark that they fell off people's love lists (will never forgive the writers for the attempted rape story line) and they made Willow obsessed with Tara's memory to the point where she wanted to destroy everyone who wasn't her.


I have nothing against a show needing to branch out and cover relevant social topics and mature their characters. That said, I prefer the simpler times for Willow's character when she was in love with Oz and another werewolf wasn't around the corner ready to snatch him up (god, I hated Veruca)

atwoodsmariano

Has anyone else made the parallel/formed the association of Oz finding an attraction to other werewolves and Willow finding an attraction to other witches in S4 cause I'm just really seeing that now that you have both of those things together side by side

I agree Willow being attracted to Tara had more to do with them both being witches than anything else

only really liked them together in S4 before it became pretty toxic with Willow wiping Tara's memory and whatnot and Spuffy was pretty good in 4 and 5 before it got really abusive in S6 (I wish Spike's S7 redemption arc wasn't based so wholly on what happened in seeing red which I haven't and will never watch)

I just wish that Spuffy scene hadn't happened at all and their abusive relationship just ended with Buffy basically telling him she was done fooling around with him (not sure if that was before or after seeing red)

Buffy's depression arc was done exceptionally well IMHO though even if it was very difficult to watch at times

^ yeah it sucks when stuff like that gets in the way of ships :/

Crystal Clear

Great observation. Bestiality and witches, both of which Oz and Willow seemed to grow unhealthily addicted to as they grew apart. I liked the metaphor for College being experimentation period, but they took it too far. I didn't buy the Oz/Veruca thing for one moment. Oz might lose himself when the wolf takes over, but he was already starting to sense her when they first caught sight of each other. Marti Noxon depicted it was more of a sexual attraction, which is what I hated. Oz is better than that.


It definitely drew them together. Willow noticed how Tara was more involved with magic at the Club than the other girls were. That outsider feeling drew them close.


Filming it nearly made James Marsters ill, he was terrified of upsetting Sarah. What kind of writers would put the actors through that kind of stress?


Agreed. It was one of the most interesting storyarcs, I just didn't like how they used her relationship with Spike to make her completely self-indulgent. It felt like a far cry from the days of Willow and Oz dealing with his werewolf transformation.