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Old 03-23-2017, 09:54 PM
  #31
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I'm actually surprised they haven't use Genosha yet. Genosha genocide by Xavier sister (?) is def among most popular X-men stories of 00's. Even though, it was barely mentioned by mutants, let alone other marvel heroes after that. At least, from what I've seen. (rarely read comics, mostly reading news about them)
And when will we get normal Emma Frost? Jean is so 2000 and late.
It's kinda sad that while Marvel and Sony used more current stories to adapt, Fox only use old stories. We don't need another Phoenix saga... They actually used astonishing X-men storyline in third movie, but it was just losely based on it.
I actually liked Burton's movies. They look very stylish. Batman and Robin and Batman Forever were awful, though. First Spider-Man reboot was actually way worse than first franchise. They only rebooted it cuz they couldn't rewrite Spider-Man 4 and just decided to scrap the whole franchise all together and create a new one. Financially it wasn't needed.
Now, with marvel help, I'm sure they'll create a good movie.
Started watching Iron Fist and it's actually better than Luke Cage in my opinion. It's not good, but at least it's not pretentious.
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Old 03-24-2017, 07:20 PM
  #32
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I'm actually surprised they haven't use Genosha yet
Me too. It would have made for a great story but perhaps not action oriented enough for them

Quote:
Genosha genocide by Xavier sister (?)
loving the question mark. Yeah she's not really his sister. More like a parasitic entity that created a body for herself using his genetic material. She's quite literally his Nemesis. The Yin to his Yang. And quite crazy which makes her an almost perfect GoT character

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Even though, it was barely mentioned by mutants, let alone other marvel heroes after that.
Well that's one of the problems with some of the storylines take on world shattering proportions and then never get really mentioned again anywhere because the writers change and the other comics are too busy in their own stories to get into it.

That's why I'd always hoped they would do something like House of M or the actual Age of Apocalypse, that mixed several comics within the same universe but obviously, as long as the mutants and Spidey belong to Fox, that will never happen.

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And when will we get normal Emma Frost? Jean is so 2000 and late.
Never now, I imagine. January Jones sucked so hard in that part, the whole movie almost got inside out from it and they won't recast now. They ruined the character. Not that she was my favorite but yeah, shame.
I love Jean Grey but the Sophie Turner incarnation left me bored. If they had done Proper Phoenix, that would have been something else

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It's kinda sad that while Marvel and Sony used more current stories to adapt, Fox only use old stories. We don't need another Phoenix saga... They actually used astonishing X-men storyline in third movie, but it was just losely based on it
I think Fox might be limited to a time frame. I'm not really sure what their contract says but since it was signed 2 decades ago for an animated show, I'm pretty sure they weren't thinking of exploiting it to make action movies 20 years later.

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I actually liked Burton's movies. They look very stylish.
Oh I agree and that's what I meant when I said they were appropriately cartoonish. They had a definite style but they remained too close to the first Batmans and they were not dark enough to allow much development.

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Batman and Robin and Batman Forever were awful, though.
Well two words: Joel Schumacher

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They only rebooted it cuz they couldn't rewrite Spider-Man 4 and just decided to scrap the whole franchise all together and create a new one.
I think it's more than that. Spiderman has literally existed for half a century but it's the same story over and over. And once they have done an origin story, a "my friend the supervillain" story and a "I'm my own enemy" story, they pretty much had exhausted all the story patterns of the comic book so they just went back to the beginning, hoping people wouldn't remember and they were mostly right

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Started watching Iron Fist and it's actually better than Luke Cage in my opinion. It's not good, but at least it's not pretentious.
I tried and gave up. I can't imagine it's worse than Luke Cage but I wasn't interested in the book and the show definitely doesn't improve on it
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Old 03-25-2017, 12:47 AM
  #33
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Me too. It would have made for a great story but perhaps not action oriented enough for them


loving the question mark. Yeah she's not really his sister. More like a parasitic entity that created a body for herself using his genetic material. She's quite literally his Nemesis. The Yin to his Yang. And quite crazy which makes her an almost perfect GoT character


Well that's one of the problems with some of the storylines take on world shattering proportions and then never get really mentioned again anywhere because the writers change and the other comics are too busy in their own stories to get into it.

That's why I'd always hoped they would do something like House of M or the actual Age of Apocalypse, that mixed several comics within the same universe but obviously, as long as the mutants and Spidey belong to Fox, that will never happen.


Never now, I imagine. January Jones sucked so hard in that part, the whole movie almost got inside out from it and they won't recast now. They ruined the character. Not that she was my favorite but yeah, shame.
I love Jean Grey but the Sophie Turner incarnation left me bored. If they had done Proper Phoenix, that would have been something else


I think Fox might be limited to a time frame. I'm not really sure what their contract says but since it was signed 2 decades ago for an animated show, I'm pretty sure they weren't thinking of exploiting it to make action movies 20 years later.


Oh I agree and that's what I meant when I said they were appropriately cartoonish. They had a definite style but they remained too close to the first Batmans and they were not dark enough to allow much development.


Well two words: Joel Schumacher


I think it's more than that. Spiderman has literally existed for half a century but it's the same story over and over. And once they have done an origin story, a "my friend the supervillain" story and a "I'm my own enemy" story, they pretty much had exhausted all the story patterns of the comic book so they just went back to the beginning, hoping people wouldn't remember and they were mostly right


I tried and gave up. I can't imagine it's worse than Luke Cage but I wasn't interested in the book and the show definitely doesn't improve on it
Genosha destruction always bothered me SO much. The way they just did it like it's nothing, and they killed off 16 million mutants! First of all, it was barely reflected in other comics. I know it was before they started massive events every year, but crossovers were already a thing, and yet...
Secondly, out of 16 million mutants no one could teleport or turn back time or something? It all seemed like Grant Morrison did it just because.
I like how they bring it back in Astonishing X-men though, even if it makes Emma a killer... Of 16 million mutants.
I love Emma. She is mine favourite X-men. It's sad she is so disrespected in movie universe. When they made her older than comics version it was clear she is not becoming a long time character.
Spider-Man 3 received bad reviews and they just started rewriting script for a 4th part again and again. They had Black Cat and Vulture as main villains, but they just decided to cancel it. Imo, it was a wrong decision.
IF is kinda better with every episode. I have strange feelings about Finn Jones. I can't understand if he is not acting good or just not trying cuz script is bad.
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Old 03-26-2017, 04:00 PM
  #34
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Genosha destruction always bothered me SO much. The way they just did it like it's nothing, and they killed off 16 million mutants!
I agree. I much preferred it when it was a segregated state. When they gave it away to Magneto, they ****ed up because honestly, how powerful could a little island with millions of mutants be?? So they used that genocide storyline by Cassandra to reset it.

Like you said, even though a lot of those mutants had useless abilities, how likely would it be that not ONE of them could do something to stop it??

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I love Emma. She is mine favourite X-men.
She was just too tacked on for me. I actually learned how to read on Astonishing Xmen comics with my uncle when I was a little squirt waaaay back in the 70ies so in the big scheme of things, she's a latecomer to me. I liked her better as a villain.

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It's sad she is so disrespected in movie universe.
Ugh. To say the least! She's there just to be a bikini bimbo for Shaw to order around. and she was never that in the comics, even back when she was operating with Shaw.

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Spider-Man 3 received bad reviews and they just started rewriting script for a 4th part again and again. They had Black Cat and Vulture as main villains, but they just decided to cancel it. Imo, it was a wrong decision.
I think they wanted a cooler Spiderman. Maguire was too close to the actual character from the comics. Shame they wasted the Venom storyline but then again, maybe they'll get back to it in the reboot(s)

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IF is kinda better with every episode. I have strange feelings about Finn Jones. I can't understand if he is not acting good or just not trying cuz script is bad.
I think he's not a great actor to start with and you'd need a really good one to elevate the material he's getting.

I'm almost done with Falling Water and I have a sinking feeling it's not going to be renewed. I thought it was a mini ****!
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Old 03-26-2017, 07:06 PM
  #35
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I agree. I much preferred it when it was a segregated state. When they gave it away to Magneto, they ****ed up because honestly, how powerful could a little island with millions of mutants be?? So they used that genocide storyline by Cassandra to reset it.

Like you said, even though a lot of those mutants had useless abilities, how likely would it be that not ONE of them could do something to stop it??
Not even to stop it, to survive it. Honestly, no one flew away? No one could teleport? Like...
Toby was a total miscast as Spider Man, IMO. But they could go Bond/Batman route and just replace him as another actor. Yeah, Venom storyline was bad... And that Sandman was a total joke.
Never heard about that show, but it looks like rating were really stable.
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Old 03-28-2017, 03:12 AM
  #36
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I have watched The Crown and I liked it. I was worried it was going to be some kind of sensationalist biopic mini but it's interesting and they're not going for the cheap shots. The cast is very good too.

Oh good to hear, I will continue to watch then

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I love love love Grace and Frankie. I didn't think I'd enjoy it so much but season 2 is even better than S1. I saw a trailer for S3 and I can't wait
I know right? I didn't read anything about it before watching and I chose it to watch by accident and because I saw the cast list

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I have seen Rita but I read good things so I'll check it out.

So far I can recommend

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Right now I'm catching up on Falling Water. It's a USA Network show so I avoided it when it aired but it turns out it's a really intense and well written show so I'm trying to make it last.
oh haven't heard about this one, I will check it

I finished watching The Bridge and I love it Do you know it?
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Old 03-29-2017, 02:21 AM
  #37
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Just popping over to say hi and will probably disappear again after this post, so don't mind me.

Carla, I remember you mentioned Black Sails a couple of years back, do you still watch it?
I won't spoil S4 anyway, just needed to scream and thought it's the best place for it.
I binged 3 seasons last summer and then rewatched it straight away, I don't know what took me so long, but I don't remember last time a show made me feel so ecstatic (Well, Homeland is probably the closest to that up to S4, I mean I still love it, just not hyperventilate all the time over it).
But almost nobody watches it, what's up with that? Why is Toby Stephens not drowning in all the awards?
The show is so so good upon rewatch! With all the little details you didn't noticed the first time round, and I don't even mean just Flint's backstory but pretty much everything and everyone.
It's general consensus that the 1st season is weaker than the rest of the show, but I was still entertained. And I wasn't bothered that much by Max's storyline in S1, probably because it wasn't very explicit and she grows so much from that point on. It's awful of course and brutal, but I believe they did her justice in the later seasons. And there was such a great moment between Anne and Eleanor because of it ("Good evening, ***t" ), I can almost forgive that arc.
And talk about the big reveal mid-season 2, that's so groundbreaking but still feels organic, because all the hints are there right from the start and you actually talked with your main actor about it beforehand!
Gaaawd, I love Flint so much, and I don't even feel the need to justify all the crazy s**t he does (*cough*Gates*cough*), I just want him to put his ****ing oar to the ground and start a book club or something (and Madi can join, she's already read *spoiler alert* Don Quixote).
And Miranda! I wish she was more fleshed out as a character, but even with so little she was given she was such a presence, and I cried so much when we lost her.
I also like his dynamic with Eleanor (half partners, half father-daughter like?), he's like the only male figure in her life who was always honest with her and didn't screw her over in any way. And that moment of 'straight-baiting' in S1? It's hilarious when you almost expect them to kiss, and instead Flint goes for her forehead. I loved it!
I can't believe it's only 1 episode left, I can't wait but at the same time I'm not ready at all. I need a support group or something.

Sorry for my rambling, I need help and I think I'm in a good company here.
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Old 03-29-2017, 03:05 AM
  #38
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I know right? I didn't read anything about it before watching and I chose it to watch by accident and because I saw the cast list
Season 3 of Grace and Frankie has me pausing to laugh out loud before hitting play again so I don't miss a single joke.
And it never fails to blow my mind that both Lily Tomlin and Martin Sheen were in The West Wing, and Jane Fonda and Sam Waterston were in the Newsroom Sorkin reunion of the best kind

Quote:
I finished watching The Bridge and I love it Do you know it?
I did. Are you talking about the remake or the original show? (The Tunnel is also good, weirdly )

Wait...

I must be dreaming I'm not! ANNAAAAAA!!

Quote:
Just popping over to say hi and will probably disappear again after this post, so don't mind me.
Boo

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Carla, I remember you mentioned Black Sails a couple of years back, do you still watch it?
Yep. I've actually enjoyed the last two seasons even more than the first two.

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I won't spoil S4 anyway, just needed to scream and thought it's the best place for it.
glad you remembered this is the place you can always scream

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I binged 3 seasons last summer and then rewatched it straight away, I don't know what took me so long, but I don't remember last time a show made me feel so ecstatic (Well, Homeland is probably the closest to that up to S4, I mean I still love it, just not hyperventilate all the time over it).
They really do know how to work through intense storylines. I think it's a bit of a slow burn for most people which doesn't make it for everyone (you know, the guys wanting to see a lot of fighting ) but the way they keep building characters and stories, and dynamics, in layers, is very very addictive

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But almost nobody watches it, what's up with that? Why is Toby Stephens not drowning in all the awards?
Well, I guess Starz never really pushed it. They probably don't have the money to push anything because they barely got Kelsey Grammer nominated for a pity Golden Globe for Boss and that was a brilliant performance by a well known and awarded guy so...
I'm just glad it got enough viewers to be renewed despite the costs of the sets and they are getting to tell the story they wanted to tell to the end.

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The show is so so good upon rewatch! With all the little details you didn't noticed the first time round, and I don't even mean just Flint's backstory but pretty much everything and everyone.
Heh Flint's backstory makes the rewatch SO worth it. They really took their time on that one but damn, that was a big boom! And nobody can say it was a last minute thing because it's always been there. We were just not watching
Man, the dude-bros were so bitter about it, it was brilliant

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It's general consensus that the 1st season is weaker than the rest of the show, but I was still entertained.
I'd say it was entertaining. It wasn't as convoluted or intense as the other seasons I guess.

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And I wasn't bothered that much by Max's storyline in S1, probably because it wasn't very explicit and she grows so much from that point on.
Well, I'm bothered as a human being because nobody should go through things like that and a lot of women do. As a viewer, like you say, they made a point of not making it graphic, because it wasn't there for the sick entertainment of some of the guys, and it was not gratuitous because it was a cathartic moment for her. If all the stories of this type were explored that way, that would be very different from what we have today.

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And there was such a great moment between Anne and Eleanor because of it ("Good evening, ***t" ), I can almost forgive that arc.
Damn, I loved those scenes! The scenes at the beach following this whole encounter were also brilliant.
People can say what they want about the female characters but they can't say they're weak or one-dimensional.

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And talk about the big reveal mid-season 2, that's so groundbreaking but still feels organic, because all the hints are there right from the start and you actually talked with your main actor about it beforehand!
and ofc when you have an actor you can trust to not overplay it, it's best. I dread to think what other lesser actors would have done with it.

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Gaaawd, I love Flint so much, and I don't even feel the need to justify all the crazy s**t he does (*cough*Gates*cough*), I just want him to put his ****ing oar to the ground and start a book club or something (and Madi can join, she's already read *spoiler alert* Don Quixote).
Somehow I doubt that'll happen but hey, at least it was a good ride. Interesting pirate, who knew?

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And Miranda! I wish she was more fleshed out as a character, but even with so little she was given she was such a presence, and I cried so much when we lost her.
I didn't see that coming! Damn! I think Louise Barnes helped flesh the character out, even with the limited material. She was crazy good in those last episodes, and since
She has a recurring part in the Outsiders S2 and she's amazing again.

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I also like his dynamic with Eleanor (half partners, half father-daughter like?), he's like the only male figure in her life who was always honest with her and didn't screw her over in any way. And that moment of 'straight-baiting' in S1? It's hilarious when you almost expect them to kiss, and instead Flint goes for her forehead. I loved it!
that was so ****ing brilliant! After that, people were betting on how long it would take for them to have sex but yeah nope. I liked how their relationship evolved through the seasons too. From one side to the other.

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I can't believe it's only 1 episode left, I can't wait but at the same time I'm not ready at all. I need a support group or something.
You know where to find me

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Sorry for my rambling, I need help and I think I'm in a good company here.
Always and you don't need help. You just need... support

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Never heard about that show, but it looks like rating were really stable.
Whew that's good news. Season 1 ended in the best way if you're not going to be renewed but they have more stories to tell. I just wasn't sure it was the kind of show that would work on USA
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Old 03-29-2017, 07:44 AM
  #39
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And it never fails to blow my mind that both Lily Tomlin and Martin Sheen were in The West Wing, and Jane Fonda and Sam Waterston were in the Newsroom Sorkin reunion of the best kind
Exactly Oh I miss his shows, I need to watch something


Quote:
I did. Are you talking about the remake or the original show? (The Tunnel is also good, weirdly )
The Danish / Swedish one is the original, right? Then yes, I watched the original
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Old 03-29-2017, 09:32 AM
  #40
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I must be dreaming I'm not! ANNAAAAAA!!
Carla! You are very kind, and I really miss talking to you! (But I'm too depressed to, well, actually talk)

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Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
Heh Flint's backstory makes the rewatch SO worth it. They really took their time on that one but damn, that was a big boom! And nobody can say it was a last minute thing because it's always been there. We were just not watching
And it's such a complex story! He's lost his loved one (and a promising career) not just because of homophobia, but because homophobia was used for political reasons (and when is it not, really?). "And then they called me a monster?" Ugh!
I love that the creators said they don't even think it was James' first same-sex sexual relationship, but a romantic one, which is why it's so tragic to have such disastrous consequences. It makes so much cense, considering the show's theme about shame being one of the driving forces of civilization.

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Man, the dude-bros were so bitter about it, it was brilliant
It's glorious! I'm registered on a site where you can check all the episodes of shows you watch (it's in Russian so I don't recommend it. ETA: you can switch to English actually, so I'll give the link just in case), and you can comment as well. All the other episodes of Black Sails usually get less than a hundred of comments, but 2x05 got more than 1400 and you can pretty much imagine the content of them
It's so satisfying to watch them cry how "such a dude show was ruined by this twist". "Dude show", ha! Maaaan, you know nothing Jon Snow. They also complain S4 is boring because of "too much talking", I wonder how they lasted this long!


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Well, I'm bothered as a human being because nobody should go through things like that and a lot of women do. As a viewer, like you say, they made a point of not making it graphic, because it wasn't there for the sick entertainment of some of the guys, and it was not gratuitous because it was a cathartic moment for her. If all the stories of this type were explored that way, that would be very different from what we have today.
Yep, that's what I meant, I'm not that good at articulating things lol.
It was probably easier for me bc I binge-watched it, it was still heart-breaking and disturbing of course, but it resolved pretty quickly and with satisfying outcome. And what helped is that it was the ladies who got s**t done!

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Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
and ofc when you have an actor you can trust to not overplay it, it's best. I dread to think what other lesser actors would have done with it.


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Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
Somehow I doubt that'll happen but hey, at least it was a good ride. Interesting pirate, who knew?
I'm gonna stay in denial till the finale airs, and then I'm gonna pretend that it was all a horrible dream, after which James wakes up in the governor's house in Nassau, with Thomas and Miranda beside him, because Alfred Hamilton had a stroke right after he left the house that evening he had an argument with Thomas over the pardons (see, he could have been robbed and stabbed and left to die, but I have mercy!). And Thomas became the governor, and New Providence island was the first colony to get independence from England (historical accuracy? what's that? ), and they adopted Eleanor and later Abigail (because Peter Ashe was robbed and stabbed and left to die, duh!), and all is well, and nobody will convince me this is not what actually happened *lalala*

Spoiler:


But anyway my prediction is that Flint will die a symbolic death, while McGraw will finally find his peace, and I'm gonna print this page out next Sunday and eat it if I'm wrong.

I need to know more what you think of Miranda, and the relationship between all three of them. I've read some people think she was kinda jealous and hurt after T&J relationship started (pointing at the look on her face in the scenes when T&J kissed, and when she sat with a book with T's inscription to J), but it's too simplistic to view it that way. She was a bit side-lined, sure, and she was worried for them, but the things she said to James after he came back to London from Nassau about loving both of them speaks volumes imo.
(You should've listened to her at THAT moment, James, and not blame her later for convincing you to leave after Thomas had already been taken ). And I love her line in S3 about being a mother to him, considering the lack of mother figures in his life that we know of, and she was probably the closest to one.
And OMG the way she's turning her face up to the sun, longing for love and joy in life
But what I also like about her is that she's vengeful as well and not afraid to admit that she wishes for both Alfred Hamilton and Peter Ashe to die and the whole city to burn!

Also, Thomas. I saw some opinions that he's a bland, uninspiring character and ofc I can't sit still when someone's wrong on the Internet . Idk, I'm probably biased, but I love him so much, and he had such an influence on James (making him transform from pragmatist to an idealist of sorts), and left such a void in both Miranda's and Flint's lives. What's your thoughts?

On a side note, this is perfection:

Spoiler:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
I liked how their relationship evolved through the seasons too. From one side to the other.
He was so kind to her in the end! It's so fitting for her character to have the last moments before death with him, given that they shared the vision for Nassau. And she died the moment Nassau was burned to the ground by the hands of the same people who were responsible for her mother's death, which was her worst nightmare (thanks, hubby, you're a true gift!), and she talked about it with Miranda in the same house where she died! These writers really love their stories coming full circle.
Oh, and Miranda's house! What's even left for Flint at this point? I'm sobbing again. (*cough* you know who I'm looking at *cough*)

Unpopular opinion, but I don't care that much about Silver. I like Flint's dynamic with him, but I kinda enjoyed it more in the first two seasons, when Silver was a "little s**t" And sure, Flint found a new purpose in life when Silver talked him out of sacrificing himself in S3 (btw this post ), and I loved that he found someone he could confide in after Miranda's death (which is a huge step for him), but it still feels pretty much one-sided? Even with all this talk how it hurts Silver that Flint betrayed his trust in 4x09. But I'll probably need a rewatch after the show is done to form a final opinion on him. (Still think Madi is the Queen and he's not worthy Her speech to Rogers! )
Btw, Luke Arnold is adorable in his fangirling over the show


Whew, this is the longest I've ever written about Black Sails (or any show, for that matter), I need to rest.
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:56 PM
  #41
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Exactly Oh I miss his shows, I need to watch something
Doing a Newsroom rewatch this weekend!

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The Danish / Swedish one is the original, right? Then yes, I watched the original
and honestly, it's the best one. The American one could have been great because they had all the Mexican-US border to work with and that changes the dynamic, as well as the partnership, and the politics and all quite a bit, but it was too focused on twists and turns and not on the characters enough. And the lead actress kinda sucked, unlike the original, who was brilliant.

The Brit/French version is not too bad but well, when you know the end already, they haven't changed enough to make it a must watch. The actress is pretty good, although French (I know, I should be supporting my countrymen but ) and the Brit cop is our buddy Stannis Baratheon! so the acting is good

Quote:
Carla! You are very kind, and I really miss talking to you! (But I'm too depressed to, well, actually talk)
Aww buddy! Sorry to read you've been depressed
Sometimes it does help to talk, sometimes it's just better to find escapism in books and screens. Anyway, I'm here for both

Quote:
And it's such a complex story! He's lost his loved one (and a promising career) not just because of homophobia, but because homophobia was used for political reasons (and when is it not, really?).
I know, right? They didn't go the "easy way" with that either.

Quote:
I love that the creators said they don't even think it was James' first same-sex sexual relationship, but a romantic one, which is why it's so tragic to have such disastrous consequences.
I think that's why he didn't see it coming. He was unprepared to have real feelings for someone. I mean... it's hard now so I can't even imagine living in a time like this. The odds of finding love must have been very low

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It makes so much cense, considering the show's theme about shame being one of the driving forces of civilization.
A very good point!

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It's glorious! I'm registered on a site where you can check all the episodes of shows you watch (it's in Russian so I don't recommend it. ETA: you can switch to English actually, so I'll give the link just in case)
Very cool! Especially now that IMDB boards are no more. I need trolls to massacre

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All the other episodes of Black Sails usually get less than a hundred of comments, but 2x05 got more than 1400 and you can pretty much imagine the content of them
Yep. The "stronger sex" wailing like little bitches because they identified with a man who turned out to prefer the company of men.

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They also complain S4 is boring because of "too much talking"
Must be why I love it

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It was probably easier for me bc I binge-watched it, it was still heart-breaking and disturbing of course, but it resolved pretty quickly and with satisfying outcome. And what helped is that it was the ladies who got s**t done!
I understand and I agree with the fact that there is such a thing as a "rape culture" in tv and movies especially. But it's because they either trivialize sexual assault or worse, use it for titillation and entertainment. It's appalling. However when a show or a movie portrays rape without sexualizing it, with no graphic scene, and uses it for characterization in a realistic way, it's not the same thing. Nobody would say that The Accused is "part of the rape culture".

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I'm gonna stay in denial till the finale airs, and then I'm gonna pretend that it was all a horrible dream, after which James wakes up in the governor's house in Nassau, with Thomas and Miranda beside him, because Alfred Hamilton had a stroke right after he left the house that evening he had an argument with Thomas over the pardons (see, he could have been robbed and stabbed and left to die, but I have mercy!). And Thomas became the governor, and New Providence island was the first colony to get independence from England (historical accuracy? what's that? ), and they adopted Eleanor and later Abigail (because Peter Ashe was robbed and stabbed and left to die, duh!), and all is well, and nobody will convince me this is not what actually happened *lalala*
wow that's quite an alternate reality is there room for two in Denial Land?

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But anyway my prediction is that Flint will die a symbolic death, while McGraw will finally find his peace, and I'm gonna print this page out next Sunday and eat it if I'm wrong.
With milk. It helps digest ink

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I need to know more what you think of Miranda, and the relationship between all three of them.
I think she really did truly love Thomas. True love is selfless. She wanted nothing more than his happiness and she knew he would never love her that way so was she jealous? I don't think so. Probably very worried for him and maybe worried that James was either going to hurt him or get him hurt. At least at the beginning.

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But what I also like about her is that she's vengeful as well and not afraid to admit that she wishes for both Alfred Hamilton and Peter Ashe to die and the whole city to burn!
Damn! That rage! I didn't expect the scene to end like that, obviously, but she was all fire!

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Also, Thomas. I saw some opinions that he's a bland, uninspiring character and ofc I can't sit still when someone's wrong on the Internet
You must be quite busy. The internet is the place people go to be wrong
He was never meant to be a full blown character so ofc his characterization wasn't going to be as thorough as one of the core cast (which is damn huge so it's a wonder they managed to develop supporting characters at all) and we see him only in flashbacks, which further limits the scope of characterization. However I wouldn't call him bland and uninspiring. Far from that. We get to know him more through James, the impact he had on him, and James and Miranda's love for him. I think it might be a little too second degree for most tv watching folks.

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On a side note, this is perfection:
Heh, it really is well thought I never saw it that way but that would explain why they were a perfect trinity

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These writers really love their stories coming full circle.
Beautifully so. Seriously, with that many characters, all on their own arc and colliding with each other, it's a pure feat of genius writing that they managed to keep track and actually make things like that happen.

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Oh, and Miranda's house! What's even left for Flint at this point? I'm sobbing again. (*cough* you know who I'm looking at *cough*)
I don't even know what keeps him going, besides the will to finish what he started and to honor James's memory.

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Unpopular opinion, but I don't care that much about Silver.
Nope same here. And I think that of all the characters, his development has been the least convincing. It feels like they operate in leaps and bounds with him, leaving gaps in their wake. It's probably because he's the only character they don't really have complete freedom with. The fact they want to get him as close as possible to the Treasure Island character before the end, makes the whole thing feel contrived, imo, and makes it really hard for me to get involved in his journey.

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and I loved that he found someone he could confide in after Miranda's death (which is a huge step for him), but it still feels pretty much one-sided?
It does. And it's not on the actor because he's doing real good work. It's just that the writers seem to assume a connection but didn't put any effort into making it real for the characters, and the viewers by extension

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(Still think Madi is the Queen and he's not worthy Her speech to Rogers! )
That's the only interesting thing they did with his character but ofc, having read the book, I knew as soon as she appeared...

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Btw, Luke Arnold is adorable in his fangirling over the show
it must feel good to be proud of a show like that. They have all the reasons to be but it's not always the case when you're an actor.

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Whew, this is the longest I've ever written about Black Sails (or any show, for that matter), I need to rest.
I missed your posts. You make mine feel like tweets by comparison but you know I can never resist a thorough discussion about anything so don't be a stranger
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~~~~~

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Last edited by Gelfling; 03-31-2017 at 09:02 PM
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Old 04-01-2017, 05:39 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
Aww buddy! Sorry to read you've been depressed
Sometimes it does help to talk, sometimes it's just better to find escapism in books and screens. Anyway, I'm here for both
Thank you for the support, truly.
It's not that bad, I think, and there are no particular reasons for it, apart from... life (I'm starting to think I was born this way lol). I just feel meh all the time and not willing to communicate with people. Escapism is my way

I'm gonna say a few things before the finale (I'M NOT READY!!), and then I'm gonna come back and respond to your post properly (if I'm able to produce any coherent thought at all lol).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
I understand and I agree with the fact that there is such a thing as a "rape culture" in tv and movies especially. But it's because they either trivialize sexual assault or worse, use it for titillation and entertainment. It's appalling. However when a show or a movie portrays rape without sexualizing it, with no graphic scene, and uses it for characterization in a realistic way, it's not the same thing. Nobody would say that The Accused is "part of the rape culture".
I've now realized that I should have worded what I meant better. Ofc I was bothered by that arc, I just didn't mind that it existed as some fans did, because these things should be addressed, and, as you said, it's not the things that happen in fiction that enable the rape culture, but the way they're treated, and Black Sails did a good job.

(I remember watching that film late at night, I have an ability to choose a perfect time for such things! )

Btw same thing happened with Homeland recently. I don't want to spoil anything, if you haven't seen S6 yet, but it was strongly implied that one of the characters was sexually abused by their superior while being a minor, and the reaction among fans was... quite something. Some refused to believe that what was said (not in a direct way, so I can see where the confusion comes from) was meant to be about the said character and not the people they worked with at that time, or that it was sexual abuse at all. Others were disappointed and/or outraged that this arc exists at all, like how can you (the writers) treat this character this way after establishing them to be strong, etc.
It's ironic that this reaction mirrors perfectly the reactions to the abuse allegations in RL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
wow that's quite an alternate reality is there room for two in Denial Land?
Of course there is! The more the merrier!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
With milk. It helps digest ink
I love milk! So no objection from me on this one
But seriously, I'm so convinced that it will happen, I don't know what I'm gonna do with myself if I'm wrong. And the reason I am so convinced is that Flint's final moments as it was described in TI (asking for rum before being gone) kinda already happened: he told Miranda about the original Mr. Flint, who asked his grandfather (Darby McGraw?) for rum before disappearing. And Toby confirmed it:


Spoiler:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
I missed your posts. You make mine feel like tweets by comparison but you know I can never resist a thorough discussion about anything so don't be a stranger
You gotta be kidding me, seriously! I've always kinda envied your ability to notice and analyze all the little details, not to mention that I simply don't know so much stuff and have learnt a lot from you!
Okay, I'm done for now and will come back later to discuss the finale (and everything else lol)!
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Old 04-02-2017, 01:26 AM
  #43
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Sorry for double post, but I just watched Black Sails finale and reeeeally need to get this out of my system.
I was preparing myself for misery and crying my eyes out, but I wasn't prepared for such a finale at all!
I want to live in it forever. Like they should teach the art of storytelling (about storytellers) in universities using the example of this show.

And thank you Black Sails for making history by subverting one of the saddest tropes:
Spoiler:


And also:
Spoiler:

I'm dead.
But I'm gonna be back! (LOOOOOOL)
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Old 04-02-2017, 05:02 PM
  #44
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Thank you for the support, truly.
It's there, whether you need it or not

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It's not that bad, I think, and there are no particular reasons for it, apart from... life
Depression doesn't need a reason, really. It's like wearing sunglasses indoors. It just gives you a screwed perspective on things. But life is enough to feel depressed alright. And that's also the reason I don't watch the news.

Quote:
Escapism is my way
that's a good way

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Btw same thing happened with Homeland recently. I don't want to spoil anything, if you haven't seen S6 yet
I haven't yet actually. I watched the premiere and wasn't very enthused and then I guess a lot of news happened and the whole terrorism thing didn't fit into my escapism so much.

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Others were disappointed and/or outraged that this arc exists at all, like how can you (the writers) treat this character this way after establishing them to be strong, etc.
That's something I also have a problem with, when it comes to that kind of stories but the reaction of the audience bothers me more. The implication that being a survivor of abuse somehow weakens a character makes me mad. I think someone who manages to pull through something like that and to move forward despite everything makes them some of the strongest people around, imo.

I do remember the reaction of the Downton Abbey audience when the rape storyline happened. They were more outraged at "that sort of things" happening in their idyllic show than at the actual rape.

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It's ironic that this reaction mirrors perfectly the reactions to the abuse allegations in RL.
it is. Sometimes very sadly so.

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Of course there is! The more the merrier!
See you there, I'll bring refreshments

Quote:
And the reason I am so convinced is that Flint's final moments as it was described in TI (asking for rum before being gone) kinda already happened: he told Miranda about the original Mr. Flint, who asked his grandfather (Darby McGraw?) for rum before disappearing.
Heh I thought the exact same thing when he was telling that story.

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Either he's the biggest troll ever, or... Ugh, I'm trying to manage my expectations, but it's really hard!
well people ask questions that they just know he's not going to answer! He can't spoil everything!

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I've always kinda envied your ability to notice and analyze all the little details
Some people find it less charming but I'm glad you like it

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Sorry for double post
Now we call them "bonus posts"

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I want to live in it forever. Like they should teach the art of storytelling (about storytellers) in universities using the example of this show.
And so sadly underrated! I think it will live on though

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And thank you Black Sails for making history by subverting one of the saddest tropes:
that was quite a coup

Quote:
But I'm gonna be back! (LOOOOOOL)
Just keep watching it and then come back to talk about it
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"You can just call me Root, B!tch"

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Old 04-03-2017, 01:42 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
It's there, whether you need it or not


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
that was quite a coup
Brought to you by the creators of straight-baiting
(Also, this)

OK, a few thoughts on the finale.

Can I just say that it feels so ***ing good to be right about something for once? (I'm not even going with "I told you so" )
Lol I even got my "waking up from a horrible dream" bit, of sorts.
And I've never had a better dinner, considering I didn't have to digest ink.

I wanted Flint to be hugged (and kissed and wrapped in a blanket, and fed cookies) for so long, I'm in heaven it happened. The infamous pirate captain Flint was unmade by the power of love!

Spoiler:


A realist in me appreciates that there's enough room for interpreting it all as being one of the stories created by Silver (in a show that is all about the power of storytelling!), with enough hints pointing to that direction, i.e. we never really see the conclusion of his and Flint's conversation in the woods, and birds startling into flight, as if there was a shot fired.
But the pessimist in me (yes, I do mean pessimist, i.e. the person who even in the best possible circumstances always sees the possibility of it all going to hell in a matter of seconds) chooses to believe in what was presented in front of our eyes, because there's enough misery in RL in general, so can I have this fictional poor soul to find his ***ing peace with the love of his life (in whose name he waged a war on the ***ing British Empire), pretty please? Not like they got a true happy ending, being forced to live in that labor camp and all, no matter how humane the conditions in it are. Also, I'm backing this version up again by what Toby said on twitter some time ago that Flint himself would not see his end as a tragedy.
(Besides, not to sound like some tumblr SJW, but to end this particular story of a gay character in such a way that it's only a lie would be just cruelty beyond redemption imo. I mean, if he'd simply just died in a battle for his ideals, or in any other similar way, without the possibility of his reunion with Thomas being ever presented to us, I would be OK with it. Well, not completely OK, but you get my point. A classic tragic ending for a tragic hero. But I don't find this Atonement-like version to be more *poetic*, as some people do. It's just cruel, as I said)

On a side note, how many days (hours?) will it take Flint to come up with an escape plan? Or is it better to leave it to Thomas to persuade the owner of the camp to reform the camp in such a way that nobody will have to stay there without them choosing so?
They are going to turn it into a book club! James/Thomas is the force to be reckoned with! I need a spin-off.

Maaan, they really planned all this in advance, remember Peter Ashe sending Abigail off to Savannah, so that she would not cause trouble during the Flint's trial?
(Silver mentioned that "the governor in Carolina made use of" the camp. I'm not saying that she was sent to this camp exactly, but Ashe was talking about some friend, and it looks too suspicious to be a coincidence)

Also, this needs to be appreciated more:



The speech that Jack gave in the very next scene after Silver told Madi about Flint is SO meta, I can't.
("A story is true. A story is untrue. As time extends, it matters less and less. The stories we want to believe... those are the ones that survive, despite upheaval and transition and progress. Those are the stories that shape history")

Loved Jack!
I didn't care about him much in the beginning, even though he often cracked me up, but he really grew on me over the seasons, and this season he's something else. Not to mention that he is his best self when he listens to Max!
It was so satisfying watching him resist the urge to keelhaul Rogers and making him pay in a much more suitible way. I'm dying: of loves & lighthouses
Also, Toby Schmitz's facial expressions are a gift!

Loved that Featherstone became the governor! His stanning for Max payed off.

Loved that last shot of Max, being the real power behind the scenes.


And she didn't have to sacrifice an important part of herself to achieve this.

I wish there were more Max and Anne and some interaction between them, but I think their arc was concluded beautifully in 4x08, so I'm not complaining.

I wish there was more Madi's pov (and the maroons in general). Her smile when she saw Flint on deck And her grief when she thought he was killed by Silver.
I feel her anger towards Silver for undermining her entirely. But at the same time I understand his desire to end the war and the suffering. That's a conflict I can live with. And in the end he will always feel her resentment for what he's done, so.
Btw, despite what Madi said about him having it planned for days (weeks?), I think he decided to act on it only after Flint told him that he would probably do the same to have Thomas back.

I wish that kiss was longer, I'm shallow as that *sorrynotsorry*

All in all, it feels so great to have a finale that gives room for hope for all the characters, even though their future is hanging upon them, being it the historical one (Jack, Anne, Max by extension, given that Rogers will come back to serve as a governor after being released from the debtor's jail), or as described in TI (Silver. But not Flint, thankfully! No way he's gonna drink himself to death. Btw this ). And it's so refreshing not to have a finale that's all doom and gloom!

Luke Arnold continues to be adorable







Quote:
Originally Posted by Gelfling (View Post)
Just keep watching it and then come back to talk about it
Sounds like a plan!
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My FF handle was a joke (now I hate it).

Last edited by PetiteFleur; 04-03-2017 at 06:17 AM
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