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Old 12-31-2016, 07:42 AM
  #16
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Originally Posted by secretk (View Post)
Yeah, that's another thing that is left for people to interpret . I actually don't think that Bright was bully in general. I think that he was acting up because of the guilt he felt knowing that he was driving that car.

I think that Bright and Colin were the typical jocks. Not the actual real jocks, but the way jocks are portrayed in TV series. I think that they were a bit cocky and self confident and all that. I guess if they were good players they might have been also popular enough in the town. Everwood is small town so if say there are some tournaments and their football team wins it would be something the people would like.

I guess I feel that if Colin was full on bully Amy would not have liked him that much. So in this sense I feel like Colin might have been cocky, sometimes going too much with joking with someone, but not into the full blown bully mode.

I think that in the end Colin felt so much pressure from everyone to remember and get to the older Colin they all knew that he had to resort to physical ways to blow off steam and let go of his frustration. I never felt that this is who he is though. I actually saw him being scared of himself and unsure what's going on.
I honestly thought Bright was awful to Ephram. He was a bully in the literal term. He was cruel and horrible to Ephram.

Amy's girl friends were the typical stuck up mean girls too. Honestly, I saw Colin and Bright as the male version of Katie and Kayla. They were all very full of themselves and looked down on others.

Colin was very cold and insensitive towards Amy right before the accident. It's obvious they were having major problems.

I think this is why Amy was drawn to Ephram in the first place... it was the very first down to earth, kind, decent person she had close interaction with in who knows how long. Ephram was not like Colin and I think that's why she was drawn to him all the more.

I don't believe Colin and Bright walked around physically hurting people they looked down on. But they certainly didn't give them the time of day and maybe teased them or said mean things. That's bullying in my mind too.

I don't know... I just know Colin was more like Bright than he was Ephram. Bright had thankfully changed his ways by the time the middle-end of season 2 and certainly season 3 hit though.
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Old 01-01-2017, 02:39 PM
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Koni, I am with Michelle here. I can't cut Bright and Colin the slack you do. Jocks or not...a bully is a bully jock (even on TV) does not equal Bully. Both my boys were jocks...as well as my daughter and they wouldn't dream of bullying anyone.
I hated Bright for most of season 1 and couldn't stand Colin the end of season one. I can't give a bully any benefit of the doubt...especially regarding Ephram!
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Old 01-01-2017, 03:47 PM
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Yes, as an athlete myself in the "popular" group and having both guy and girl friends in this group I can say we never acted like Bright and Colin. In fact, one of my friends was named homecoming Queen because of how amazing she was to everyone, no matter what group they belonged to.

Colin and Bright were mean bullies. Bright was really unlikable outside of his interaction with Delia. Bright and Colin were like brothers basically and there's no way Colin wasn't like Bright, personality-wise. They had to have very similar ways of thinking and existing. Colin didn't even care when Amy was clearly upset in the flashback. He didn't care. One can say he was going to break up anyway but is that any way to treat your first crush who happens to be your best friend's sister? What about the Abbott's who seemed like they welcomed him with open arms? On top of it all... what kind of boneheaded thinking for Colin to introduce alcohol before driving carelessly. Truth of the matter is, Colin, naturally made really bad decisions. He had this aura around him like he thought he walked on water and everyone was below him. Bright worshipped him.

Ephram was bullied and treated badly during the first part of season 1. It made me sick.
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Old 01-22-2017, 04:14 PM
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I think that Colin was definitely a jerk before the accident. Sweet/Charming when he needed to be but definitely jerky. I'm not sure he was a "bully" per say, even though Bright sort of was, I can imagine Colin being the ringleader and Bright doing the dirty work. Colin probably didn't waste his time with people that were beneath him.

Post accident I think Colin was a pretty nice guy. I think he was just so confused because of everything people were telling him and obviously frustrated because of the memory loss and trying to live up to peoples expectations, and he was still recovering from the coma. Unfortunately, he started to go downhill because of his injuries and didn't get the chance to grow and develop into a new/better person. Which is really sad.
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Old 01-22-2017, 11:52 PM
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I honestly thought Bright was awful to Ephram. He was a bully in the literal term. He was cruel and horrible to Ephram.
I guess I just think that while Bright was awful to Ephram he had his reasons that were yes completely wrong. However I still think that there were reasons for Bright's behavior that went beyond him just being bully. If he was just bully he wouldn't have changed that quickly. This doesn't mean that he was nice guy like Ephram. He wasn't that either, but for me he also wasn't complete jerk to anyone.

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Amy's girl friends were the typical stuck up mean girls too. Honestly, I saw Colin and Bright as the male version of Katie and Kayla. They were all very full of themselves and looked down on others.
It could have been this way you are right, but I just didn't see proof enough to be sure.

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Colin was very cold and insensitive towards Amy right before the accident. It's obvious they were having major problems.
To be honest I didn't think that he was cold and insensitive. He wanted to break up with her because he realized that he didn't have that much feelings for her. Sure Amy thought that she loved him, but we all know that she didn't exactly love him either. Colin was actually smart enough to realize that their relationship has to end.

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I think this is why Amy was drawn to Ephram in the first place... it was the very first down to earth, kind, decent person she had close interaction with in who knows how long. Ephram was not like Colin and I think that's why she was drawn to him all the more.
Ephram for sure wasn't Colin. I guess I see things a bit differently. I do think that at first Amy talked to Ephram because of Colin. She stayed with Ephram because of Ephram. I think that the more she was interacting with Ephram, the more she realized that this is the guy she needs.

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I don't believe Colin and Bright walked around physically hurting people they looked down on. But they certainly didn't give them the time of day and maybe teased them or said mean things. That's bullying in my mind too.
This I agree with. I think that they were definitely teasing people per accident. However my initial point was that Colin's behavior towards Ephram in the end had nothing to do with Colin being bully. I just think that the reasons were different. For me it was about Colin's frustration with the accident, his frustration with everyone pressuring him and the fact that from his side Ephram did went for his girlfriend behind his back. I will be pissed if some girl acts as a friend towards me and then I realize that she kind of wants to date my boyfriend.

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I don't know... I just know Colin was more like Bright than he was Ephram. Bright had thankfully changed his ways by the time the middle-end of season 2 and certainly season 3 hit though.
I agree here as well. Colin was more like Bright than Ephram. I think that for the most we see the common ground. What we differentiate for sure is the way we interpret Colin going off Ephram. But hey it's OK. We generated good Everwood discussion .
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Old 01-24-2017, 04:14 PM
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Post accident I think Colin was a pretty nice guy. I think he was just so confused because of everything people were telling him and obviously frustrated because of the memory loss and trying to live up to peoples expectations, and he was still recovering from the coma. Unfortunately, he started to go downhill because of his injuries and didn't get the chance to grow and develop into a new/better person. Which is really sad.
I still can't get over how he was forced back into school and was immediately thrown to the wolves, having to understand math, adjust to all those people around him again. He had memory issues, how on earth was he going to immediately remember math again, using a brain that is not functioning 100% healthy.
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Old 01-24-2017, 04:29 PM
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I guess I just think that while Bright was awful to Ephram he had his reasons that were yes completely wrong. However I still think that there were reasons for Bright's behavior that went beyond him just being bully. If he was just bully he wouldn't have changed that quickly. This doesn't mean that he was nice guy like Ephram. He wasn't that either, but for me he also wasn't complete jerk to anyone.
He was popular, arrogant, and a bully to Ephram, for sure. He definitely had a reason why he was unsure of Ephram. They also had other friends who clearly didn't necessarily look to be perfect gentlemen. I mean, it wasn't just Bright and just Colin.

I don't know what to think because we really didn't see Bright in general around others to know how he treated people in general.

I sway back and forth with this one.

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To be honest I didn't think that he was cold and insensitive. He wanted to break up with her because he realized that he didn't have that much feelings for her. Sure Amy thought that she loved him, but we all know that she didn't exactly love him either. Colin was actually smart enough to realize that their relationship has to end.
But this is what bothers me... good that he knew he wanted to break up... but... why didn't he break up? He clearly kept her hanging because he was either too distracted by good times with Bright/friends or he kept her hanging since it was clear Amy was really fed up and upset over their situation. I got the impression they had problems for a while. So for me, I don't respect the fact that Colin knew it was over, he didn't want to be with her yet he paused and hesitated in breaking up with her. He should have broken up with her earlier than the flashback but certainly during the flashback. I just hate when people pause and take too long to break someone's heart. It's weak and cruel. Why Colin paused I am not sure. Man up and do it already but he never did.
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Old 01-24-2017, 10:27 PM
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He was popular, arrogant, and a bully to Ephram, for sure. He definitely had a reason why he was unsure of Ephram. They also had other friends who clearly didn't necessarily look to be perfect gentlemen. I mean, it wasn't just Bright and just Colin.
For me the things are not black and white because Amy was hanging around with them too and she wasn't a bully. So for me it was never cut black clear how much each of them was actually a bully.

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I don't know what to think because we really didn't see Bright in general around others to know how he treated people in general.
That's my problem in believing that Bright was a bully. The teasing I agree with you. That we saw. In other words it's a spectrum and we don't know where Bright and Colin fell in that spectrum.

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But this is what bothers me... good that he knew he wanted to break up... but... why didn't he break up? He clearly kept her hanging because he was either too distracted by good times with Bright/friends or he kept her hanging since it was clear Amy was really fed up and upset over their situation. I got the impression they had problems for a while. So for me, I don't respect the fact that Colin knew it was over, he didn't want to be with her yet he paused and hesitated in breaking up with her. He should have broken up with her earlier than the flashback but certainly during the flashback. I just hate when people pause and take too long to break someone's heart. It's weak and cruel. Why Colin paused I am not sure. Man up and do it already but he never did.
I see. If a person interprets the things this way I totally see why they would think that Colin was cold.

I actually interpret it quite differently. For me Colin had hard time to break up with Amy. He knew that they had to break up because it wasn't going to work out for them in the long term, but he had hard time letting it go because he respected Amy. He grew up with her. He was best friends with his brother. Amy wasn't just some random girl that he could break up with and never interact with her again. They were friends and I do think that he knew very well that Amy wouldn't take it that well. What we saw as Amy in Season 1 while Colin was in a coma is what would have happened if Colin had broken up with her. Amy needed time to let the idea of being in love go. No matter who the guy was. It was not about Colin. It was about her realizing that she hadn't had that big love that she wanted to think that she had.
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Old 01-25-2017, 09:26 AM
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For me the things are not black and white because Amy was hanging around with them too and she wasn't a bully. So for me it was never cut black clear how much each of them was actually a bully.
I was just thinking of Amy's friends before responding to your post.

Do you think Amy's friends (Katie and Kayla) were versions of Bright and Colin?

I always thought Amy was attracted to Ephram because she was different than her friends. We obviously saw how shallow and superficial they were because they pretty much acted like they didn't know her in season 2 and by season 3 their friendships fizzled.

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I see. If a person interprets the things this way I totally see why they would think that Colin was cold.

I actually interpret it quite differently. For me Colin had hard time to break up with Amy. He knew that they had to break up because it wasn't going to work out for them in the long term, but he had hard time letting it go because he respected Amy. He grew up with her. He was best friends with his brother. Amy wasn't just some random girl that he could break up with and never interact with her again. They were friends and I do think that he knew very well that Amy wouldn't take it that well. What we saw as Amy in Season 1 while Colin was in a coma is what would have happened if Colin had broken up with her. Amy needed time to let the idea of being in love go. No matter who the guy was. It was not about Colin. It was about her realizing that she hadn't had that big love that she wanted to think that she had.
Let's say the accident never happened... how soon do you believe Colin would have broken up with Amy and can you imagine a scenario of how he would have broken up with her?
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Old 01-25-2017, 10:17 AM
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I was just thinking of Amy's friends before responding to your post.

Do you think Amy's friends (Katie and Kayla) were versions of Bright and Colin?
I do not think that Katie and Kayla were actually close friends of Amy. I saw them more as acquaintances of Amy. Laynie was her close friend, but she moved away after the accident. Everwood is not a big town so Amy didn't find that good friends anyway and decided to basically tolerate Kayla and Katie. They were bullies, but I honestly thought that Amy was too preoccupied with Colin's stuff to notice them.

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I always thought Amy was attracted to Ephram because she was different than her friends. We obviously saw how shallow and superficial they were because they pretty much acted like they didn't know her in season 2 and by season 3 their friendships fizzled.
For me it was a mix of things. Ephram was different than what they were used. Not just the physical appearance, but also as a person. I don't mean just the fact that he is not bully. I am talking about the way he thinks, the way he behaves. Btw Laynie and Ephram had enough in common. Amy was close to Laynie so I do think that in general she actually likes people like Epgram and Laynie.

But back to the -point. Ephram was the first one that was actually for Amy and supported her. He was the first one that tried to understand what she was going through. He was the one that selflessly offered her to try with Colin even though they both knew that he had feelings for her. He was the one that went to the hospital for Colin's second surgery to support her.

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Let's say the accident never happened... how soon do you believe Colin would have broken up with Amy and can you imagine a scenario of how he would have broken up with her?
I do think that he wouldn't have waited for more than a month. The way I see it by the end of the summer (even sooner) he would have broken up with her. I think that he would have tried to show her that they are not for each other. I think that he knew that they are not endgame so I believe that this is how he would break up with her.
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Old 01-25-2017, 01:56 PM
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I do not think that Katie and Kayla were actually close friends of Amy. I saw them more as acquaintances of Amy. Laynie was her close friend, but she moved away after the accident. Everwood is not a big town so Amy didn't find that good friends anyway and decided to basically tolerate Kayla and Katie. They were bullies, but I honestly thought that Amy was too preoccupied with Colin's stuff to notice them.



For me it was a mix of things. Ephram was different than what they were used. Not just the physical appearance, but also as a person. I don't mean just the fact that he is not bully. I am talking about the way he thinks, the way he behaves. Btw Laynie and Ephram had enough in common. Amy was close to Laynie so I do think that in general she actually likes people like Epgram and Laynie.

But back to the -point. Ephram was the first one that was actually for Amy and supported her. He was the first one that tried to understand what she was going through. He was the one that selflessly offered her to try with Colin even though they both knew that he had feelings for her. He was the one that went to the hospital for Colin's second surgery to support her.



I do think that he wouldn't have waited for more than a month. The way I see it by the end of the summer (even sooner) he would have broken up with her. I think that he would have tried to show her that they are not for each other. I think that he knew that they are not endgame so I believe that this is how he would break up with her.
We were never really able to see how close Laynie was to those other friends. I wish we would've gotten the opportunity to see that.

Yes, I just think Amy was naturally popular so she would have inherited the popular group whether she liked it or not. That was the same thing for me growing up. I was in Amy's situation as well which is why I can relate to the character so much. Thankfully, my popular group wasn't like her popular group but there were a few that were just like Katie and Kayla. No one was like Collin or Bright though.

Amy definitely didn't have an Ephram in her life before this time period. Their connection, combined with this reality was like heaven on earth for Amy.

Yes, I think Laynie would've made sure he broke up relatively soon or else she probably would've told Amy. No way would she have let her brother string Amy along (in her mind) for a long period of time before her stepping in knowing he wanted to break up.
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Old 01-26-2017, 02:54 AM
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We were never really able to see how close Laynie was to those other friends. I wish we would've gotten the opportunity to see that.
You know that I liked Laynie a lot so I never disagree with a suggestion for having more Laynie . Yes I would have wanted Laynie to stay after Colin's death.

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Yes, I just think Amy was naturally popular so she would have inherited the popular group whether she liked it or not. That was the same thing for me growing up. I was in Amy's situation as well which is why I can relate to the character so much. Thankfully, my popular group wasn't like her popular group but there were a few that were just like Katie and Kayla. No one was like Collin or Bright though.
I guess it depends. It's a bit about luck. I do agree with you. Amy was popular. I assume those girls were popular as well. So they were friends more because of the popularity than anything else. Not all popular people are jerks or bullies. Sometimes the bullies are girls, sometimes boys. It depends on the class. For example I was 12 grade, there was a case in my school where a girl had broken the nose of a guy. They were in 8th grade. We were like "WTF". I mean having some arguments with someone happens, but breaking someone's nose. And the way she did it. She basically jumped from a desk and kicked him in the nose. Obviously there were consequences for her. I am just saying that boys and girls can be bullies. It depends on the person.

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Amy definitely didn't have an Ephram in her life before this time period. Their connection, combined with this reality was like heaven on earth for Amy.
They had something that she didn't have with others. That's for sure. What I meant is that it wasn't just about whether Ephram was popular or not. It was more about how Ephram acted around her, how he treated her and what feelings he triggered in her.

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Yes, I think Laynie would've made sure he broke up relatively soon or else she probably would've told Amy. No way would she have let her brother string Amy along (in her mind) for a long period of time before her stepping in knowing he wanted to break up.
I think that both Bright and Laynie would have encouraged Colin to do it.
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Old 01-26-2017, 02:50 PM
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You know that I liked Laynie a lot so I never disagree with a suggestion for having more Laynie . Yes I would have wanted Laynie to stay after Colin's death.
Me too. I still wish we had the real story of why Nora left the show. Did she want to leave for other projects or was Berlanti just finished with the Laynie story? I guess we'll never know. A lot of people think Hannah replaced Laynie and maybe she did. However, I remember back in the day being on Fanbolt Everwood spoilers when the sides came out about Hannah being a single white female type who was going to become obsessed with Amy and want her life. That was the original story for Hannah. Somehow that changed, obviously, lol. Thus, I am not sure Hannah was meant to originally replace Laynie if she was going to be a stalker/psychotic type of person. But I think when they changed the sides and Hannah's story, maybe they did think Laynie was expendable.

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I guess it depends. It's a bit about luck. I do agree with you. Amy was popular. I assume those girls were popular as well. So they were friends more because of the popularity than anything else. Not all popular people are jerks or bullies. Sometimes the bullies are girls, sometimes boys. It depends on the class. For example I was 12 grade, there was a case in my school where a girl had broken the nose of a guy. They were in 8th grade. We were like "WTF". I mean having some arguments with someone happens, but breaking someone's nose. And the way she did it. She basically jumped from a desk and kicked him in the nose. Obviously there were consequences for her. I am just saying that boys and girls can be bullies. It depends on the person.
Wow about that girl. LOL!

Oh for sure, girls can be bullies too. Absolutely they can be, either physically or emotionally. In many ways, when Ephram wasn't welcome at that party, indirectly he was being bullied too and that was all about Amy's girlfriends.

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They had something that she didn't have with others. That's for sure. What I meant is that it wasn't just about whether Ephram was popular or not. It was more about how Ephram acted around her, how he treated her and what feelings he triggered in her.
Definitely.

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I think that both Bright and Laynie would have encouraged Colin to do it.
Speaking of Bright... do we know if Bright knew before the accident, like Laynie, that Colin was breaking up with Amy? I don't remember if he knew, or maybe we were just expected to assume Colin told him or Laynie knew.

Then again, if Bright did know before the accident, Colin's plan was to break up with Amy; I wonder why Bright would have fought so hard to keep Amy away from Ephram. He seemed to want to mark Colin's territory due to guilt and loyalty to Colin. If he knew Colin was breaking up with his sister but didn't get the chance, it doesn't make sense why Bright would have been so threatened by Ephram around Amy. Hmm.
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Old 01-26-2017, 10:17 PM
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Me too. I still wish we had the real story of why Nora left the show. Did she want to leave for other projects or was Berlanti just finished with the Laynie story? I guess we'll never know.
Oh I thought that she left because they didn't have a story for her once Colin died, but maybe you are right. Maybe there were other reasons.

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A lot of people think Hannah replaced Laynie and maybe she did.
If we talk about female friend of Amy then yeah Hannah replaced supposedly Laynie. I actually don't think that Hannah and Amy were that close friends. They were kind of too different on some topics and they didn't always want to meet in the middle. In any case for me honestly Amy and Hannah became friends because of Ephram. I don't see them getting them closer if Hannah wasn't with Nina. Don't get me wrong. I like Sarah Drew and the Hannah character is not bad, but Laynie wins me over every time.

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However, I remember back in the day being on Fanbolt Everwood spoilers when the sides came out about Hannah being a single white female type who was going to become obsessed with Amy and want her life. That was the original story for Hannah. Somehow that changed, obviously, lol. Thus, I am not sure Hannah was meant to originally replace Laynie if she was going to be a stalker/psychotic type of person. But I think when they changed the sides and Hannah's story, maybe they did think Laynie was expendable.
Interesting. I didn't know that. I also think that if Hannah was supposed to be obsessed with Amy, she would have been recurring character and wouldn't stay till the end of Season 4. And I guess she also wouldn't have something with Bright. Maybe they changed for the Bright/Hannah story?

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Wow about that girl. LOL!
Exactly LOL! The guys in our class were like too stunned to even comment on how wrong this was. The girl was in the class of the brother of one of our classmates. That's why we knew that story. Also our English teacher (who was responsible for our class all 5 years) was teaching this class so he had mentioned it as well. Not sure if it's the same with you, but in our high schools the whole class (for the whole year) is split in several groups. Each group has around 26 people. And this is what we call class. So our year had 8 such groups. Each group had responsible teacher. This teacher is the one that communicates with parents if there are problems with some student. For our year it was really hard to keep the same teacher responsible for us all 5 years. We were actually the only group that managed to do so. We really appreciated our teacher. He was our English teacher, we spent in 8th grade almost the time with him because we had like 22 hours English in the week. We bought him some present each year. We organized over night staying trips with him and the whole group. We bought a present for his daughter when she was born and we even met in the park with his woman and the baby. In the end of our last year we gave him a tea mug with all of our names.

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Oh for sure, girls can be bullies too. Absolutely they can be, either physically or emotionally. In many ways, when Ephram wasn't welcome at that party, indirectly he was being bullied too and that was all about Amy's girlfriends.
True. In most cases girls are emotional bullies, but some can get quite physical.

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Speaking of Bright... do we know if Bright knew before the accident, like Laynie, that Colin was breaking up with Amy? I don't remember if he knew, or maybe we were just expected to assume Colin told him or Laynie knew.
I don't remember right now as well.

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Then again, if Bright did know before the accident, Colin's plan was to break up with Amy; I wonder why Bright would have fought so hard to keep Amy away from Ephram. He seemed to want to mark Colin's territory due to guilt and loyalty to Colin. If he knew Colin was breaking up with his sister but didn't get the chance, it doesn't make sense why Bright would have been so threatened by Ephram around Amy. Hmm.
This was my train of thought as well. If Bright knew that Colin was about to break up with Amy, he wouldn't mark his friend's territory with Ephram. So most probably he didn't know. However I do think that Colin would have talked to him about this.
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Old 01-27-2017, 03:33 AM
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Speaking of Bright... do we know if Bright knew before the accident, like Laynie, that Colin was breaking up with Amy? I don't remember if he knew, or maybe we were just expected to assume Colin told him or Laynie knew.
If Bright knew that Colin was planning to break up with Amy...would he have been so angry with Ephram because he believed Ephram was stealing Colin's girl?
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