[secretk]

Ghost Whisperer

So yesterday I finished watching the series and this is some sort of summary on my thoughts about the show.

This is not the perfect show for binge watching. Not because is boring, but because it's a little bit heavy and you kind of have sort of formula for each episode. There is a ghost that Melinda has to help to crossover. The ghosts she dealt with usually were not bad even though some might have looked like that. In a nutshell they are redeemable. So yeah the more episodes you watch in a row, the more you will see the general formula of the show which sucks. This is why my recommendation is no more than 2-3 episodes per day.

I liked the acting. We have already discussed this, but I think that the main parings had great chemistry and felt realistic. I especially loved Melinda/Andrea and Melinda/Jim. Nothing against Delia, I just preferred Andrea.

Until the second season I think that the writers dealt with the general mystery of the show in really good way. It was paced great. I do not like shows where they introduce mystery in the series premiere, spend 20 episodes not talking about it and then resolve it in the finale. In that regard I felt that the writers did good in the first two seasons. I will explain below why it did not work that well in the last 3 seasons.

Now some problems that I saw with the show. Not that I did not enjoy it because I did, but I would have liked it more if they had resolved some of the issues below or avoid them in some cases (Jim's death and I will explain below why).

1. The show started with the mystery around Romano and the laughing man. And basically seriously I never understood how they ended the problem with them in Season 2. Basically Melinda was disrupting their plan. They needed ghosts to not crossover so that they could feed of their energy. That I got. What I did not get how they just disappeared the moment the kids saved Melinda.
2. Talking about the kids that saved Melinda. I liked the idea of those kids and the abilities they had. What I did not like how the writers did not continue with this story. Why were those accidents happening? Would they continue happening? They kind of dropped the ball on this.
3. Talking about not following on storylines, next one is Gabriel. What the hell happened with him once they killed Tom Gordon? What the hell Gabriel and Tom wanted anyway? Gabriel was never brother of Melinda. How did he have the same abilities as Melinda? Pure coincidence? I doubt it. Why Tom was so interested in Melinda's mother and their abilities?
4. How and why did Tom appear to Melinda? Who was using his soul and why? Was it the good or the bad guys?
5. What did Gabriel and Tom wanted with the souls in the underground? And talking about them they forgot about them after Season 3 as well. They did not crossover. At least I don't remember seeing this and wasn't Melinda all about crossing over and how ghosts should not stay on Earth.
6. Talking about crossing over. The show did not explain why the ghosts need to crossover. At least not the way I wanted them to explain it. And especially having in mind that Jim did not crossover they kind of contradicted each other. They can't have it both ways. They claim that the ghosts should crossover but yet Jim can stay and is seen as ultimate soulmate move. And this is why I dislike Jim's death story. It is not about him dying, it's the way they handled this. If it was in any other show I would have been OK with it, but when they spend like 3 seasons telling us how ghosts should crossover we are supposed to accept that he did not crossover?
7. Again talking about crossing over. Eli's parents did not crossover. Bedford did not crossover. Nor his mother. Are we supposed to assume that Bedford and his mother were taken over by the shadows completely. I could buy that. Still though I don't buy that Melinda did not try to help Eli's parents to crossover. Not to mention that it would be dangerous for them with the shadows.
8. Talking about the shadows. How they appeared? And what was their goal? For me it was similar to Romano and the laughing man - feed of the energy of the ghosts. However what is the difference between Romano and the shadows. Did he turn into shadow or not? Overall they did not have time to refine the shadows and shinies theory and I simply do not believe that everything ended up for sure with what Aidan did in the series finale. That was kind of funny. Shinies have spent so much time fearing the shadows and then the 5 years old Aidan shows them they should not be afraid . Like really? There was no else all those years to tell them that?
9. The finale did not feel finale at all. Like I said in the previous point I did not see this as war between shinies and shadows. It was a battle and if there was war, it had just begun with this battle. I could not believe that this would stop the shadows forever.
10. I would have liked some ghosts that were not that easy redeemable. It felt a bit corny at times. The show strayed away from the really bad people. And I do believe that such people exist. There is darkness after all. Btw when they first introduced the shadows I had another theory about them that I liked more. I believe most of us have good and bad in ourselves. Luckily most of us balance it out and we don't do horrible things, but we still have some darkness in us. So I thought that the shadows are basically the darkness that stays behind when the ghosts crossover. I think that I still like this theory more.
11. They did not handle the Bloody Marry ghost that we saw appearing in the Season 3 episode. I assume their idea was to address this, but maybe the writers strike obligated them to rush in to prepare for the season finale. Still though they could have addressed this in Season 4.

Not a bad show if you see it as procedural. They did good overall when it comes to each episode. I do find it a bit lacking in the longer arcs department. I have seen worse for sure, but still some things could have been done better.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Very true.

Yes it is

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Yes, so true about Mark not knowing what to do with Peyton. Plus, he had to physically separate Leyton as much as possible because he wasn't ready to revisit them romantically just yet. Season 1 was the foundation for Leyton, the meant to be tag, the solid foundation was built. Then a major kink happened and Mark had to physically separate them for the most part because they were too convincing together. Get Lucas and Peyton anywhere near each other and you feel their romantic connection and you wonder why they are not reunited yet. Mark couldn't have that because he had to wait on them interacting a ton. There is an Everwood parallel too... Greg Berlanti had to separate Ephram/Amy as well in season 2 because the Ephram/Amy love story was way too believable and Berlanti didn't want them to get together romantically until the last several episodes of season 2. Thus, they didn't share the screen a ton in season 2 before then. They were too convincing. That is precisely what happened with Leyton too. That and Mark didn't know what to do with Peyton as a whole.

Yep, Mark knew that Lucas and Peyton couldn't be in each other's lives in S2 if Brucas and Jeyton were going to look believable. I get the thinking behind it, but I wish he handled their separation differently and focused more on LP's individual growth that season before rebuilding their friendship too.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) You definitely need to watch the whole series to evaluate a character or make generalizations about a character. I'm with you... I would have kept Jenny in the picture. Good point about it even being like a foreshadowing of 5.12. That said, I couldn't see Brooke as hands on with Jenny like Peyton immediately was. I think it would take Brooke a way longer amount of time to handle a relationship with Jake when there's Jenny to make the #1 priority. Brooke was the definition of self absorbed back then. Keeping Jenny around certainly would make her grow up a lot more quickly though.

Yep, and it's the same with couples really. Brooke definitely couldn't be so hands on with Jenny earlier on. but I didn't think it made that much sense with Peyton either tbh. Brooke growing up and realising Jenny would have always been Jake's #1 priority would have been an great storyline for her imo and her growing up early would have been better for everyone.

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) I wonder when Mark decided to get Naley married.

Probably in the episode itself, it was pretty last minute imo.

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Really, outside of seeing some happy moments with Leyton/daughter and the two families of Leyton and Naley interacting, I think we received everything as a shipper fanbase. We got a beautiful wedding, birth of of child, meant to be tag that existed since day 1 so there was no doubt their ending wasn't convincing... what more could we have asked for? We received everything.

Yes we did and I'm pretty happy at our ending at the end of S6 even though I wanted to see some more family moments.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) Yep, Mark knew that Lucas and Peyton couldn't be in each other's lives in S2 if Brucas and Jeyton were going to look believable. I get the thinking behind it, but I wish he handled their separation differently and focused more on LP's individual growth that season before rebuilding their friendship too.

Exactly. It would have been much better focusing on their individual growth instead of what we received. Peyton and cocaine? Really? I actually found that very out of character. Even as a psychologist, I found that weird. Usually when you hit the cocaine point, you've already been drinking like a fish, smoking pot daily, and then it evolves into more hardcore drugs like cocaine. Peyton just sort of skipped the usual process and went for it. I also didn't love that it was Jake that "saved" Peyton either. Mark tried so hard to make us believe they fell head over heels in love with each other or that Jake was even partially why she went there with the cocaine too. I didn't like how Peyton was constructed in season 2 at all. It didn't make sense to me. I could see her upset over her father not be around, most certainly. But the way she handled feeling abandoned was severe.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) Yep, and it's the same with couples really. Brooke definitely couldn't be so hands on with Jenny earlier on. but I didn't think it made that much sense with Peyton either tbh. Brooke growing up and realising Jenny would have always been Jake's #1 priority would have been an great storyline for her imo and her growing up early would have been better for everyone.

I mentioned up thread or on a past thread I thought it was downright unhealthy Peyton was instantly in hands on mode for Jenny. Peyton had a great heart and was way more mature than Brooke at this point, but it still didn't make any sense and I actually found myself feeling uncomfortable watching some of those scenes, especially seeing Peyton and Jake looking at Jenny while she was sleeping like they were this older married couple with a long history. It just looked weird to me. If they had been dating for a couple of years I could see this scenario but not immediately. Good point that Brooke would have had to have dealt with Jake's priority being Jenny. She would have grown up very fast and understood there are way more important scenarios out there than faking a pregnancy to get back at a boy you had a crush on.

Probably in the episode itself, it was pretty last minute imo.

I remember Mark stating he was surprised by the chemistry between James and Joy and really had to cash in on their connection on screen. So he obviously didn't even plan on Naley getting together romantically until he personally viewed the two actors on screen and was impressed by their chemistry. I just wonder when he decided to get them married after first realizing he was putting them together romantically.

Yes we did and I'm pretty happy at our ending at the end of S6 even though I wanted to see some more family moments.

Me too. Satisfied with Leyton's ending made the idea of watching 7-9 a lot easier. I thought it'd be kind of cool to sit back and watch knowing my main ship sailed already. However, the second it became obvious Mark was trying to sell Clay/Quinn as the new Leyton my annoyance set in. Then the eventual jabs usually from Brooke's mouth insinuating Leyton was off in their own world as a family not caring about them anymore was irritating too. Eventually it was obvious Clay/Quinn flopped as the new Leyton so I got over that even if they bugged the crap out of me during the next three seasons. But the comments here and there from Brooke, a little bit with Haley about Lucas and Peyton not being around for them was annoying because it was so obvious it was merely Mark's frustration. It was a solid reminder that the series should have ended the second it was clear Chad and Hilarie weren't returning. Still, even throughout the seasons 7-9 mess I thought about Leyton's happy ending as a family and that was always the bright shining star.

[jediwands]

One Tree Hill, the actress who plays Lindsey

I love it. There's a reason why I despised the character of Lindsey on One Tree Hill... I knew she was a manipulative witch and the fandom was never meant to actually like her and see her as genuine.

Right in the OP of her thread on the OTH board here is a direct quote on Lindsey from the actress:

"Boring, Stupid, Fake, Undignified, Crazy." ~ Michaela on Lindsey

THANK YOU. I've always said, the actor that plays the character understands over everyone how the character ticks. I think it's obvious how Lindsey was meant to be portrayed on the screen. I am glad I picked up on it from the start. I knew she was this wolf in sheep's clothing sort of character overall. I assumed it was because I was a biased Leyton fan but it's nice to know that wasn't the case at all and it was just the character all along. The actress spelled it out nicely. I seriously hated the character and I'm glad it was justified.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Exactly. It would have been much better focusing on their individual growth instead of what we received. Peyton and cocaine? Really? I actually found that very out of character. Even as a psychologist, I found that weird. Usually when you hit the cocaine point, you've already been drinking like a fish, smoking pot daily, and then it evolves into more hardcore drugs like cocaine. Peyton just sort of skipped the usual process and went for it. I also didn't love that it was Jake that "saved" Peyton either. Mark tried so hard to make us believe they fell head over heels in love with each other or that Jake was even partially why she went there with the cocaine too. I didn't like how Peyton was constructed in season 2 at all. It didn't make sense to me. I could see her upset over her father not be around, most certainly. But the way she handled feeling abandoned was severe.

I remember that Hilarie didn't like the cocaine storyline since she didn't that it wasn't like Peyton to do something like that. I think pot would have more sense imo or even drinking too. I didn't like the implication that Jake saved Peyton either, since that meant imo that him leaving was the way she was at the start of the season and that's not true at all. Luke not being in her life and her Dad not being around were far bigger reasons for that for me and it was just an misrepresentation of S1 Jeyton. What would you have liked to have seen with Peyton instead and what made you think her reaction to being abandoned was severe? What did you think of S2 Luke?

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) One Tree Hill, the actress who plays Lindsey I love it. There's a reason why I despised the character of Lindsey on One Tree Hill... I knew she was a manipulative witch and the fandom was never meant to actually like her and see her as genuine. Right in the OP of her thread on the OTH board here is a direct quote on Lindsey from the actress: THANK YOU. I've always said, the actor that plays the character understands over everyone how the character ticks. I think it's obvious how Lindsey was meant to be portrayed on the screen. I am glad I picked up on it from the start. I knew she was this wolf in sheep's clothing sort of character overall. I assumed it was because I was a biased Leyton fan but it's nice to know that wasn't the case at all and it was just the character all along. The actress spelled it out nicely. I seriously hated the character and I'm glad it was justified.

Hahah, I bet you were happy when you saw that

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) I mentioned up thread or on a past thread I thought it was downright unhealthy Peyton was instantly in hands on mode for Jenny. Peyton had a great heart and was way more mature than Brooke at this point, but it still didn't make any sense and I actually found myself feeling uncomfortable watching some of those scenes, especially seeing Peyton and Jake looking at Jenny while she was sleeping like they were this older married couple with a long history. It just looked weird to me. If they had been dating for a couple of years I could see this scenario but not immediately. Good point that Brooke would have had to have dealt with Jake's priority being Jenny. She would have grown up very fast and understood there are way more important scenarios out there than faking a pregnancy to get back at a boy you had a crush on.

Yes it was and for someone who was as closed as she was at the start of S1, it should have taken a lot longer for Peyton to be as hands on with Jenny as she was and I think Mark rushed that aspect of her development so he could go the Jeyton route. Those scene were pretty uncomfortable for me considering how they were together for only like a couple of weeks at that point and even worse when considering that Peyton was in love with Luke an couple of months previously. Brooke might have been less matured, but it would have taken her less time imo to be able to look after Jenny since she didn't have the issues that Peyton had. Yep and I think everyone would be happy with that development.

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) I remember Mark stating he was surprised by the chemistry between James and Joy and really had to cash in on their connection on screen. So he obviously didn't even plan on Naley getting together romantically until he personally viewed the two actors on screen and was impressed by their chemistry. I just wonder when he decided to get them married after first realizing he was putting them together romantically.

I've read that and not sure exactly they decided on the marriage storyline, but I would have been shocked if it was planned in that far in advance.

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Me too. Satisfied with Leyton's ending made the idea of watching 7-9 a lot easier. I thought it'd be kind of cool to sit back and watch knowing my main ship sailed already. However, the second it became obvious Mark was trying to sell Clay/Quinn as the new Leyton my annoyance set in. Then the eventual jabs usually from Brooke's mouth insinuating Leyton was off in their own world as a family not caring about them anymore was irritating too. Eventually it was obvious Clay/Quinn flopped as the new Leyton so I got over that even if they bugged the crap out of me during the next three seasons. But the comments here and there from Brooke, a little bit with Haley about Lucas and Peyton not being around for them was annoying because it was so obvious it was merely Mark's frustration. It was a solid reminder that the series should have ended the second it was clear Chad and Hilarie weren't returning. Still, even throughout the seasons 7-9 mess I thought about Leyton's happy ending as a family and that was always the bright shining star.

I haven't really watched a lot of S7-9 and I've kinda got no interest to since I was pretty much watching for LP at that point. I love Brulian and Naley, but they aren't an good enough reason for me to check them out.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) I remember that Hilarie didn't like the cocaine storyline since she didn't that it wasn't like Peyton to do something like that. I think pot would have more sense imo or even drinking too. I didn't like the implication that Jake saved Peyton either, since that meant imo that him leaving was the way she was at the start of the season and that's not true at all. Luke not being in her life and her Dad not being around were far bigger reasons for that for me and it was just an misrepresentation of S1 Jeyton. What would you have liked to have seen with Peyton instead and what made you think her reaction to being abandoned was severe? What did you think of S2 Luke?

Hilarie didn't like it? Awesome. I agree, it was entirely out of character and like I said to jump to such a hard-core drug just doesn't happen. You're right, pot would make the most sense or drinking too much but cocaine is not only something Peyton would never do but it just doesn't make sense that she jumped to something so severe. You're right, given everything Peyton and Luke went through in season one it makes sense that she would be completely upset over that, in addition to her father not being around and still mourning the loss of her mother. I refuse to believe she developed such strong feelings for Jake while supposedly forgetting about her feelings for Lucas. It just doesn't add up or make sense. I just would've preferred Peyton in pain over the loss of her mom, father not around and essentially losing Lucas, while using her art to get through the tough times instead. Lucas was okay in season 2. Lucas and Anna were OK but I still think it would've worked better (and actually made sense) if he would've figured out he wanted to be with Peyton, not Brooke. The end of season two and Lucas thinking he wanted to be with Brooke kind of killed the momentum for Luke in season two.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) Hahah, I bet you were happy when you saw that

Leigh showed me, it was an early Christmas present.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) Yes it was and for someone who was as closed as she was at the start of S1, it should have taken a lot longer for Peyton to be as hands on with Jenny as she was and I think Mark rushed that aspect of her development so he could go the Jeyton route. Those scene were pretty uncomfortable for me considering how they were together for only like a couple of weeks at that point and even worse when considering that Peyton was in love with Luke an couple of months previously. Brooke might have been less matured, but it would have taken her less time imo to be able to look after Jenny since she didn't have the issues that Peyton had. Yep and I think everyone would be happy with that development.

Exactly. Yes it was so weird. I remember people creating avatars with Peyton, Jake and Jenny titling it family. I was stunned.

I've read that and not sure exactly they decided on the marriage storyline, but I would have been shocked if it was planned in that far in advance.

I think you're right, it was certainly not planned super far in advance.

I haven't really watched a lot of S7-9 and I've kinda got no interest to since I was pretty much watching for LP at that point. I love Brulian and Naley, but they aren't an good enough reason for me to check them out.

Right, it's definitely not worth it. At most, just watching their scenes alone would be fine. I wish that's what I would've done. I could've deleted all the other crap and just watched those two pairings and scenes with the core three as long as Clay and Quinn weren't around.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) Ghost Whisperer So yesterday I finished watching the series and this is some sort of summary on my thoughts about the show. This is not the perfect show for binge watching. Not because is boring, but because it's a little bit heavy and you kind of have sort of formula for each episode. There is a ghost that Melinda has to help to crossover. The ghosts she dealt with usually were not bad even though some might have looked like that. In a nutshell they are redeemable. So yeah the more episodes you watch in a row, the more you will see the general formula of the show which sucks. This is why my recommendation is no more than 2-3 episodes per day. I liked the acting. We have already discussed this, but I think that the main parings had great chemistry and felt realistic. I especially loved Melinda/Andrea and Melinda/Jim. Nothing against Delia, I just preferred Andrea. Until the second season I think that the writers dealt with the general mystery of the show in really good way. It was paced great. I do not like shows where they introduce mystery in the series premiere, spend 20 episodes not talking about it and then resolve it in the finale. In that regard I felt that the writers did good in the first two seasons. I will explain below why it did not work that well in the last 3 seasons. Now some problems that I saw with the show. Not that I did not enjoy it because I did, but I would have liked it more if they had resolved some of the issues below or avoid them in some cases (Jim's death and I will explain below why). 1. The show started with the mystery around Romano and the laughing man. And basically seriously I never understood how they ended the problem with them in Season 2. Basically Melinda was disrupting their plan. They needed ghosts to not crossover so that they could feed of their energy. That I got. What I did not get how they just disappeared the moment the kids saved Melinda. 2. Talking about the kids that saved Melinda. I liked the idea of those kids and the abilities they had. What I did not like how the writers did not continue with this story. Why were those accidents happening? Would they continue happening? They kind of dropped the ball on this. 3. Talking about not following on storylines, next one is Gabriel. What the hell happened with him once they killed Tom Gordon? What the hell Gabriel and Tom wanted anyway? Gabriel was never brother of Melinda. How did he have the same abilities as Melinda? Pure coincidence? I doubt it. Why Tom was so interested in Melinda's mother and their abilities? 4. How and why did Tom appear to Melinda? Who was using his soul and why? Was it the good or the bad guys? 5. What did Gabriel and Tom wanted with the souls in the underground? And talking about them they forgot about them after Season 3 as well. They did not crossover. At least I don't remember seeing this and wasn't Melinda all about crossing over and how ghosts should not stay on Earth. 6. Talking about crossing over. The show did not explain why the ghosts need to crossover. At least not the way I wanted them to explain it. And especially having in mind that Jim did not crossover they kind of contradicted each other. They can't have it both ways. They claim that the ghosts should crossover but yet Jim can stay and is seen as ultimate soulmate move. And this is why I dislike Jim's death story. It is not about him dying, it's the way they handled this. If it was in any other show I would have been OK with it, but when they spend like 3 seasons telling us how ghosts should crossover we are supposed to accept that he did not crossover? 7. Again talking about crossing over. Eli's parents did not crossover. Bedford did not crossover. Nor his mother. Are we supposed to assume that Bedford and his mother were taken over by the shadows completely. I could buy that. Still though I don't buy that Melinda did not try to help Eli's parents to crossover. Not to mention that it would be dangerous for them with the shadows. 8. Talking about the shadows. How they appeared? And what was their goal? For me it was similar to Romano and the laughing man - feed of the energy of the ghosts. However what is the difference between Romano and the shadows. Did he turn into shadow or not? Overall they did not have time to refine the shadows and shinies theory and I simply do not believe that everything ended up for sure with what Aidan did in the series finale. That was kind of funny. Shinies have spent so much time fearing the shadows and then the 5 years old Aidan shows them they should not be afraid . Like really? There was no else all those years to tell them that? 9. The finale did not feel finale at all. Like I said in the previous point I did not see this as war between shinies and shadows. It was a battle and if there was war, it had just begun with this battle. I could not believe that this would stop the shadows forever. 10. I would have liked some ghosts that were not that easy redeemable. It felt a bit corny at times. The show strayed away from the really bad people. And I do believe that such people exist. There is darkness after all. Btw when they first introduced the shadows I had another theory about them that I liked more. I believe most of us have good and bad in ourselves. Luckily most of us balance it out and we don't do horrible things, but we still have some darkness in us. So I thought that the shadows are basically the darkness that stays behind when the ghosts crossover. I think that I still like this theory more. 11. They did not handle the Bloody Marry ghost that we saw appearing in the Season 3 episode. I assume their idea was to address this, but maybe the writers strike obligated them to rush in to prepare for the season finale. Still though they could have addressed this in Season 4. Not a bad show if you see it as procedural. They did good overall when it comes to each episode. I do find it a bit lacking in the longer arcs department. I have seen worse for sure, but still some things could have been done better.

I love all your thoughts. What an amazing write up. And you need help with your English? Right on.

There's some stuff that you've listed that I don't remember because it's been such a long time that I've seen the series. I wish I would've really watched along with you because I could better answer some things. Totally agree with you though that you cannot binge watch the show perfectly without feeling overwhelmed. I like your suggestion that 2 to 3 episodes max is best. The finale definitely didn't feel like a finale. I guess it was due to abruptly finding out the series was over.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Leigh showed me, it was an early Christmas present.

I saw it after you said that haha. Wonder what she said about the marriage proposal in 5.07?