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Old 09-07-2017, 04:49 PM
  #31
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Suggestions.
Got it. You have friends/family with good taste, lol.
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Old 09-07-2017, 04:50 PM
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Page turned... Alan, check out Betty's post on the previous page.
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Old 09-08-2017, 01:52 AM
  #33
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Season 1... the triangle. I wouldn't want Brooke remotely looking Luke's way from the start.
I probably would have kept the triangle in the show in season 1, but changed it to an point where none of the characters came off as badly as they did.

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Season 2... the tour. I would have preferred Joy getting time off another way but I'd still want Haley's music involved though. She could have left to study music, fine tune her music, some advanced college program or something with Nathan totally okay with it. We could have seen them test long distance in a way less dramatic way.
What would you have done instead of the tour? I think the tour annoys me more than anything since it clearly only happened because Joy was on tour in RL and even though it was meant to be Haley's storyline, it was more about poor Nathan. Honourable mentions to Brucas and Jeyton storylines this season.

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Season 3... Goes without saying Lucas and Brooke's stupid relationship. Keith's death.
Yep definitely lol. So much as it saddens me that Keith died, it did provide the show biggest continued storyline and led to Dan getting his redemption. I wouldn't change even though Keith deserved his happy ending with Karen.

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Season 4... Psycho Derek.
Yep, the writers could have easily introduced Peyton's brother into the show without the psycho aspect of that storyline.

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Season 5... Lindsey ever existing. I couldn't stand her victim mentality, subtle manipulation.
The whole Lindsay triangle was extremely contrived imo and some aspects of it didn't match up to what we got with Luke and LP in the first 4 seasons. Nanny Carrie also wasn't needed either.

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Season 6... Brooke being attacked. Peyton's very serious pregnancy. I wish we would have seen way more fun and smiles surrounding her pregnancy.
I would have liked the Brooke gets attacked storyline if the rest of the core 5 didn't all come off as horrible friends and the writers actually did something with it. I actually liked the pregnancy drama we got with Leyton and 6.17 is one of my all time favourite LP episodes because of that.
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Old 09-08-2017, 10:56 AM
  #34
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Yep, the writers could have easily introduced Peyton's brother into the show without the psycho aspect of that storyline.
Especially since her brother was a great guy. I love the real derek!
I'd have kept the triangle in s1 cheating and all! Scrapped the return brucas 2.0 and have still done jeyton but with lucas kinda lingering in the background without cheating. I'd have JP end because it was just Peyton hiding out. Dropped the tour and Nathan's OTT reaction. Never have married NH but still have them have drama. I'd have married them prob sometime in S5 as the jump sl. I didn't mind the LL sl so I'd have kept that stuff and had more onscreen Leyton in S6 with a non pregnant LP getting married.
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Old 09-08-2017, 11:11 AM
  #35
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I probably would have kept the triangle in the show in season 1, but changed it to an point where none of the characters came off as badly as they did.
I hated it so much though. But yes, if it would have ended without the revisit, I would have been okay. The other thing I hated was finding out Brooke had sex with Nathan while Nathan/Peyton were off during their on and off bit. I despise seeing Brooke cheating with Nathan, continuing pursuit of Lucas and how she did this to Peyton not caring... add in how little she knew about Peyton's struggle over the loss of her mom... Brooke was so insensitive to Peyton in about every aspect of her life and I hated it.

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What would you have done instead of the tour? I think the tour annoys me more than anything since it clearly only happened because Joy was on tour in RL and even though it was meant to be Haley's storyline, it was more about poor Nathan. Honourable mentions to Brucas and Jeyton storylines this season.
I would have had Haley go away and study music, some sort of music thing tied to education. Something that mutually both Haley and Nathan would have been on board with without the dramatic BS of that Haley/Chris kiss, Chris into her, lack of communication. The biggest drama/struggle would have been coping long distance but without lack of communication or a threat to their marriage.

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Yep, the writers could have easily introduced Peyton's brother into the show without the psycho aspect of that storyline.
Mark messed this one up. The real Derek was awesome and didn't have enough screen time.

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The whole Lindsay triangle was extremely contrived imo and some aspects of it didn't match up to what we got with Luke and LP in the first 4 seasons. Nanny Carrie also wasn't needed either.
Right, Carrie too! LOL Both LL and Carrie worked my last nerve. It wasn't just annoyance, it was lingering, wasted screentime BS that wasn't necessary. If Mark wanted drama between LP in season 5 it didn't have to be a third party. That's lazy writing. Have them be apart because of what happened in LA and give them good solid storylines on their own for a while then... Lucas and writing, Lucas and Nathan stuff, Peyton struggling with her career, etc. I dislike when showrunners feel the only way to create drama between a main pairing is with a third party/triangle. That's lazy! In real life do triangles happen? Sure, but not nearly as much as they happen on the small and large screen.

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I would have liked the Brooke gets attacked storyline if the rest of the core 5 didn't all come off as horrible friends and the writers actually did something with it. I actually liked the pregnancy drama we got with Leyton and 6.17 is one of my all time favourite LP episodes because of that.
The Brooke getting attacked story was precisely to highlight Brooke in victim mode and the others being insensitive pricks. This goes back to our theory that Mark worshipped Brooke. I think Chad and Hilarie, as usual, played Leyton to perfection in every moment on the screen, especially the dramatic moments. But since Leyton left shortly after the pregnancy drama, it would have been so nice seeing Leyton and Naley happy, spending time together, fun date nights, before Leyton left. That is why I wish the timeline would have been Leyton married in the finale of 5, Leyton giving birth around mid-season 6, some happy Leyton times until they drove off into the sunset in the finale of 6.
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Old 09-08-2017, 11:34 AM
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Especially since her brother was a great guy. I love the real derek!
I'd have kept the triangle in s1 cheating and all! Scrapped the return brucas 2.0 and have still done jeyton but with lucas kinda lingering in the background without cheating. I'd have JP end because it was just Peyton hiding out. Dropped the tour and Nathan's OTT reaction. Never have married NH but still have them have drama. I'd have married them prob sometime in S5 as the jump sl. I didn't mind the LL sl so I'd have kept that stuff and had more onscreen Leyton in S6 with a non pregnant LP getting married.
Same here, the real derek should have stayed around for longer imo. I would have kept the S1 triangle, but erased the cheating storyline. Erasing BL 2.0 is just an given lol and I might have still gotten rid of Jeyton too, mostly since I think they should have kept Larry around in S2 and introduced Ellie earlier, while rebuilding LP's friendship at the same time. Same here, Haley deserved better than that even though I enjoyed seeing the flawed side of her and I would have had NH get married at the end of S3, 4. I definitely would have gotten rid of the LL storyline since that was an waste of season for LP imo and had them get married at the end of S5.
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Old 09-08-2017, 11:50 AM
  #37
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I hated it so much though. But yes, if it would have ended without the revisit, I would have been okay. The other thing I hated was finding out Brooke had sex with Nathan while Nathan/Peyton were off during their on and off bit. I despise seeing Brooke cheating with Nathan, continuing pursuit of Lucas and how she did this to Peyton not caring... add in how little she knew about Peyton's struggle over the loss of her mom... Brooke was so insensitive to Peyton in about every aspect of her life and I hated it.
I didn't mind the triangle drama in S1 compared to S2/3 since at least, the show wasn't trying to sell BL as an ****ty love story. I definitely would have erased the cheating and had Luke break up with Brooke before LP hooked up or anything. As much as I love LP/Peyton, the sex tape was clearly an attempt to even the score between Brooke and Peyton, but at the same time it definitely wasn't OOC for either her or Nathan to do that. I would have erased Jeyton hanging out at the end of that season and replaced it with Brooke/Jake instead.

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I would have had Haley go away and study music, some sort of music thing tied to education. Something that mutually both Haley and Nathan would have been on board with without the dramatic BS of that Haley/Chris kiss, Chris into her, lack of communication. The biggest drama/struggle would have been coping long distance but without lack of communication or a threat to their marriage.
Probably would have Haley go on a academic scholarship tbh, since I think the music storyline should have been left for a later season imo. Even though I liked Chris as a character (& he was one of the few things about S2 I liked) , I would have changed his purpose to appear in that season and not have him go after Haley romantically at all.

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Mark messed this one up. The real Derek was awesome and didn't have enough screen time.
Agreed, he had the potential to be an great character and he wasn't around for nearly long enough. Should have appeared more in season 5 and 6 too.

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Right, Carrie too! LOL Both LL and Carrie worked my last nerve. It wasn't just annoyance, it was lingering, wasted screentime BS that wasn't necessary. If Mark wanted drama between LP in season 5 it didn't have to be a third party. That's lazy writing. Have them be apart because of what happened in LA and give them good solid storylines on their own for a while then... Lucas and writing, Lucas and Nathan stuff, Peyton struggling with her career, etc. I dislike when showrunners feel the only way to create drama between a main pairing is with a third party/triangle. That's lazy! In real life do triangles happen? Sure, but not nearly as much as they happen on the small and large screen.
I think my main issue with both storylines is that they were both just contrived forced attempts to create drama between both couples, when focusing on the issues between them instead would have been an much better storyline imo. Seeing both Lucas and Peyton trying to succeed career wise while trying to rebuild their relationship would have been much more interesting than Luke hiding behind an girl again because he is too scared to get hurt by Peyton again. With Naley, the injury angst at the start of S5 was much better imo than what we got with them with Carrie.

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The Brooke getting attacked story was precisely to highlight Brooke in victim mode and the others being insensitive pricks. This goes back to our theory that Mark worshipped Brooke. I think Chad and Hilarie, as usual, played Leyton to perfection in every moment on the screen, especially the dramatic moments. But since Leyton left shortly after the pregnancy drama, it would have been so nice seeing Leyton and Naley happy, spending time together, fun date nights, before Leyton left. That is why I wish the timeline would have been Leyton married in the finale of 5, Leyton giving birth around mid-season 6, some happy Leyton times until they drove off into the sunset in the finale of 6.
I think making out that LPNH were actually there for her during that time would have improved that storyline for me imo. Changing the whole timeline for Leyton's wedding and pregnancy would have worked so much better for me, since it was a bit rushed at the end of S6. Seeing more moments with Sawyer would have been fantastic imo.

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Old 09-08-2017, 01:40 PM
  #38
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Another change that I would have made to the show is making Jake an main character/member of the core 5 (now 6) in mid season 1/start of season 2.
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Old 09-09-2017, 08:47 AM
  #39
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I didn't mind the triangle drama in S1 compared to S2/3 since at least, the show wasn't trying to sell BL as an ****ty love story. I definitely would have erased the cheating and had Luke break up with Brooke before LP hooked up or anything. As much as I love LP/Peyton, the sex tape was clearly an attempt to even the score between Brooke and Peyton, but at the same time it definitely wasn't OOC for either her or Nathan to do that. I would have erased Jeyton hanging out at the end of that season and replaced it with Brooke/Jake instead.
It certainly wasn't out of character for Brooke to do that. She never respected Peyton. She never respected her concerning romantic life or family life. Peyton had to go to Whitey while she continued to mourn her mother and then Lucas too. Brooke didn't have a clue Peyton was in so much pain. She didn't care. Brooke tried pushing Peyton back to Nathan (knowing how horribly he treated her) just to get Lucas. Brooke was capable of having sex with Nathan while Nathan/Peyton were taking a short break and not having any guilt whatsoever. She was that awful. I wish when the party transpired and Brooke had that quick interaction with Jake it would have been the beginning of Brooke/Jake. That would have stopped the triangle and maybe Brooke would have had some decency in the early seasons.

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Probably would have Haley go on a academic scholarship tbh, since I think the music storyline should have been left for a later season imo. Even though I liked Chris as a character (& he was one of the few things about S2 I liked) , I would have changed his purpose to appear in that season and not have him go after Haley romantically at all.
I liked Chris too which is why I wish he wasn't drooling over every girl in Tree Hill in the beginning. I would have liked Chris and Haley as friends only without Chris being romantically attracted to her. Haley made it clear after the kiss it was just that but I still wish the kiss was eliminated. Haley got loads of hate in season 2 because of that kiss. I don't think she would have gotten so much hate if she just would have left without that interaction.

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Agreed, he had the potential to be an great character and he wasn't around for nearly long enough. Should have appeared more in season 5 and 6 too.
Definitely.

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I think my main issue with both storylines is that they were both just contrived forced attempts to create drama between both couples, when focusing on the issues between them instead would have been an much better storyline imo. Seeing both Lucas and Peyton trying to succeed career wise while trying to rebuild their relationship would have been much more interesting than Luke hiding behind an girl again because he is too scared to get hurt by Peyton again. With Naley, the injury angst at the start of S5 was much better imo than what we got with them with Carrie.
We mentioned this before... it's like Lucas didn't even mature and evolve... he was hiding behind Brooke in seasons 2/3, he was hiding behind Lindsey in season 5. That was not evolution, it was Luke being back in high school making the same mistakes. If Brooke could grow up some by season 5, you'd think Luke would be past that. Naley and the injury was a good storyline actually but the second the nanny got involved, it just went bonkers.

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I think making out that LPNH were actually there for her during that time would have improved that storyline for me imo. Changing the whole timeline for Leyton's wedding and pregnancy would have worked so much better for me, since it was a bit rushed at the end of S6. Seeing more moments with Sawyer would have been fantastic imo.
Exactly. We hardly got to see Leyton and their daughter function together as a family. She was born and they were off basically. It sucked.

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Old 09-09-2017, 08:50 AM
  #40
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Another change that I would have made to the show is making Jake an main character/member of the core 5 (now 6) in mid season 1/start of season 2.
I will always wonder why this didn't happen. Was it the actor who didn't want to go there or Mark? I thought I heard that Bryan had another project but I am not sure.
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Old 09-09-2017, 09:49 AM
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It certainly wasn't out of character for Brooke to do that. She never respected Peyton. She never respected her concerning romantic life or family life. Peyton had to go to Whitey while she continued to mourn her mother and then Lucas too. Brooke didn't have a clue Peyton was in so much pain. She didn't care. Brooke tried pushing Peyton back to Nathan (knowing how horribly he treated her) just to get Lucas. Brooke was capable of having sex with Nathan while Nathan/Peyton were taking a short break and not having any guilt whatsoever. She was that awful. I wish when the party transpired and Brooke had that quick interaction with Jake it would have been the beginning of Brooke/Jake. That would have stopped the triangle and maybe Brooke would have had some decency in the early seasons.
Yep, she definitely didn't respect Peyton enough, especially when she tried to get her back together with Nathan, someone who she knew was bad for her 'BFF' but didn't care because she wanted Lucas. Loyal best friends don't do that and I use that episode as an example when people say Brooke was OOC. I wouldn't have started Jake/Brooke up then, since I do think she and Luke needed their first relationship for their character developments, but I definitely would have changed some things about it though. Probably would have started Bake storyline at the end of Season 1 though.

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I liked Chris too which is why I wish he wasn't drooling over every girl in Tree Hill in the beginning. I would have liked Chris and Haley as friends only without Chris being romantically attracted to her. Haley made it clear after the kiss it was just that but I still wish the kiss was eliminated. Haley got loads of hate in season 2 because of that kiss. I don't think she would have gotten so much hate if she just would have left without that interaction.
I liked Chris too and besides him kissing an married woman, he didn't really do anything that bad imo. Nathan and Haley were more to blame with what went on in season 2 in my eyes and I didn't like the kiss scene, since it was OOC to do that and it kinda also tainted Naley a little bit for me.

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Definitely.
I would have loved it if him and Peyton got so close that he ended up walking her down the aisle at LP's wedding.

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We mentioned this before... it's like Lucas didn't even mature and evolve... he was hiding behind Brooke in seasons 2/3, he was hiding behind Lindsey in season 5. That was not evolution, it was Luke being back in high school making the same mistakes. If Brooke could grow up some by season 5, you'd think Luke would be past that. Naley and the injury was a good storyline actually but the second the nanny got involved, it just went bonkers.
It was annoying seeing him that way in his love life because outside of that, he was an awesome mature guy and I will never like that the writers didn't allow him to grow from his flaws just because they were too lazy to think of other ways to create drama. Luke was so poorly written in season 5 and because of it, I couldn't really blame Chad for having enough of playing Luke since the writers were clearly more concerned with pleasing all of the fanbases than giving him an decent storyline. Agreed, throwing the Nanny in there was just dumb imo.

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I
Exactly. We hardly go to see Leyton and their daughter function together as a family. She was born and they were off basically. It sucked.
We deserved to see that imo.
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Old 09-09-2017, 09:52 AM
  #42
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I will always wonder why this didn't happen. Was it the actor who didn't want to go there or Mark? I thought I heard that Bryan had another project but I am not sure.
I think they offered Bryan the chance to become an main at the end of S2, but by then he had another projects so he couldn't commit to it. He did would have accepted if he could have, so offering him it a bit earlier would have worked a lot better.
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Old 09-09-2017, 11:14 AM
  #43
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I think they offered Bryan the chance to become an main at the end of S2, but by then he had another projects so he couldn't commit to it. He did would have accepted if he could have, so offering him it a bit earlier would have worked a lot better.
That makes sense. The timing was off. It's really too bad. Jake was a great character.
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Old 09-09-2017, 11:25 AM
  #44
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Yep, she definitely didn't respect Peyton enough, especially when she tried to get her back together with Nathan, someone who she knew was bad for her 'BFF' but didn't care because she wanted Lucas. Loyal best friends don't do that and I use that episode as an example when people say Brooke was OOC. I wouldn't have started Jake/Brooke up then, since I do think she and Luke needed their first relationship for their character developments, but I definitely would have changed some things about it though. Probably would have started Bake storyline at the end of Season 1 though.
What bothers me is some people who started watching the series later (around season 5) that think Brooke gets unnecessarily ripped because she's a decent, flawed person. LOL Umm, actually watch seasons 1-4 before making that statement, please, thanks. I kid you not, I know a few people who have no idea what Brooke was like in the first half of the series and try to fight for her like she's been this angel all along. They also see Peyton season 5 and think SHE'S the Brooke Davis of the show, too. So irritating. No, just no.

When do you think would have been a good time for Brooke/Jake?

Another question... let's say a nightmare happened and Brooke/Lucas would have stayed together past season 3 and even ended up together... I had a difficult time writing that. But let's just say that transpired... would you have been on board with Peyton ending up with Jake?

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I liked Chris too and besides him kissing an married woman, he didn't really do anything that bad imo. Nathan and Haley were more to blame with what went on in season 2 in my eyes and I didn't like the kiss scene, since it was OOC to do that and it kinda also tainted Naley a little bit for me.
I agree. I liked Chris a lot. Tyler was great. Naley honestly got married too young... I really wish they would have waited a little while longer to go there. Thus, why I actually think it was really realistic that they were messed up in season 2. I will forever think it was about the both of them freaking out a bit that they got married so young. I know that was never a theme or discussed out loud but I think it was unspoken. They just got married and two seconds later Haley's leaving... spells out on a psychological level that they shouldn't have gotten married so early.

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I would have loved it if him and Peyton got so close that he ended up walking her down the aisle at LP's wedding.
Me too.

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It was annoying seeing him that way in his love life because outside of that, he was an awesome mature guy and I will never like that the writers didn't allow him to grow from his flaws just because they were too lazy to think of other ways to create drama. Luke was so poorly written in season 5 and because of it, I couldn't really blame Chad for having enough of playing Luke since the writers were clearly more concerned with pleasing all of the fanbases than giving him an decent storyline. Agreed, throwing the Nanny in there was just dumb imo.
Agreed. He was mature in every other way but this area. Thankfully he got it right. Yes, if you just take a look at Lucas season 5 as a whole, Chad had to have been annoyed playing him. He knew the character of Lucas better than any of us. He understood how stupid Lucas was being to Peyton and the situation as a whole. I hate to include this but it's probably true... he did probably want to get away from Sophia shooting daggers at him as well. I am sure that played a part too. I don't blame him for wanting to go do other stuff either. I just wish the series would have tied up the second the credits rolled in the finale of 6. I will forever dislike seasons 7-9 as a whole. OTH ended the second the finale of 6 was done. When I think of seasons 7-9 I ignore Clay/Quinn and just focus on Brooke getting a satisfying ending with Julian and Naley and family getting a great ending too. A couple of the secondary characters as well I think about but that's really it and I don't need to rewatch seasons 7-9 to SEE any of that either.

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We deserved to see that imo.
We did.

Would you be in favor of a reunion sort of like a Gilmore Girls thing?
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Old 09-09-2017, 12:17 PM
  #45
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That makes sense. The timing was off. It's really too bad. Jake was a great character.
Sucks that they didn't offer it to him a bit earlier, since while I wasn't the biggest Jeyton fan, I did really love Jake as a character and he was probably my favourite outside of core 5 (alongside Skills of course).
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