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Old 07-14-2009, 03:10 PM
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The Everwood Rewatch Fest: "Vegetative State" (S1, Ep. 12)

We'll keep this up for one week and then go on to the next episode. After you've watched the episode, you can comment on it anyway you'd like, big or small. You can focus on certain characters, scenes, quotes, or the episode as a whole. You can tie the episode to the rest of the series, or comment about it as a self-contained episode. It's all up to you! You can always give your thoughts after the one week period, as all rewatch threads will stay open for more thoughts and anymore discussion. Thanks!

Vegetative State

Written By: John E. Pogue
Directed By: Lev L. Spiro

Quote:
Original Air Date—6 January 2003
A heartbroken Ephram finds himself the odd man out as Amy prepares for Colin's homecoming. Meanwhile, Andy and Dr. Abbott join the town in a debate over the use of medicinal marijuana after a large quantity is discovered in a deceased woman's greenhouse; and Andy provides medical guidance to Nina after her son's teacher suggests she put him on Ritalin.
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If you haven't already, please feel free to comment on our previous episodes:

The Pilot
The Great Doctor Brown
Friendly Fire
The Kissing Bridge
Deer God
The Doctor Is In
We Hold These Truths
Till Death Do Us Part
Turf Wars
Is There a Doctor in the House?
A Thanksgiving Tale
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Old 07-18-2009, 06:56 PM
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With a coma patient coming home, the ethics and politics of pot, and medicating children, this episode COULD come off as one big ol' Issue of the Week type episode. I don't think it does. The pot storyline is hilarious, and then ultimately handled very well at the end. The Ritalin story is admittedly a little preachy, especially Andy rattling off stats at the beginning, but is more about Sam missing his father and Andy and Nina interacting than anything. And Colin is all about Amy and Ephram. And leads to, what is for me, one of their more memorable scenes together. I'm not going to get too into it because I'm sure everyone's heard it from me, hee: Ephram as so confident, sure of himself, and right, walking away from Amy at her most vulnerable and leaving her in awe while she looks at him and thinks about him is such a great role reversal.

HAROLD! He has about a million quotable lines in this one, hee. One after another after another. And then the big comedian of the episode turns out to have the great scene at the end and it's all just very awesome. And very Harold. And it's fun to see him in his element, like he is in the town hall with all of the local yokels that he complains about all the time. He has them in the pal of his hands until the poor older guy stands up.

Does Mike Erwin do an amazing job in this one or what? With the Previouslies, you really do get a sense of how great his acting in here. From that cocky, charming teenager, to the blank stares, the slowness, and the absolute frustration in the scene with Bright. Emily also does an incredible acting job too. Even though she sets herself up to have her hopes dashed, she's still sympathetic. And the end of the episode, where she introduces herself? That's the Amy we all want her to be. Tom's acting in the town-meeting when the guy stands up always stands out to me. You see him in the background of the shot, and he's not even able to look the guy in the eye, and he just looks so upset. And he never votes. Chris Pratt and his sad look is great with Colin too. Can't forget Andy when he's telling the Ephram story. Basically: this episode is an acting bonanza!

"That kid just wears me out!" is probably my favourite Delia line, hee.

Twelve episodes in and Sam is already behind the wheel. Foreshadowing of the S2 car crash? Or simply a coincidence? Okay, yeah, coincidence, heh.

Andy's story of how he lost Ephram is some great writing. I always did like John E. Pogue. He's great with comedy, the drama, the sap...everything, really.
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Old 07-19-2009, 01:13 PM
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I don't know what everybody else will say, but just to give out my opinion.. this episode is all about '..and I wouldn't be telling you to go back to your boyfriend'
One of, if not THE most awesome sentences in season 1
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Old 07-19-2009, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Amont (View Post)
I don't know what everybody else will say, but just to give out my opinion.. this episode is all about '..and I wouldn't be telling you to go back to your boyfriend'
One of, if not THE most awesome sentences in season 1
And the way that Greg delivers it too, oh, it's great stuff. That scene, I think, is their best in S1. Even more than the vending machine scenes. Which are hard to top!
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Old 07-19-2009, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Amont (View Post)
I don't know what everybody else will say, but just to give out my opinion.. this episode is all about '..and I wouldn't be telling you to go back to your boyfriend'
One of, if not THE most awesome sentences in season 1
This is the scene that made us realize how selfless Ephram's love was for Amy was....how her happiness was all that was important to him...even if he had to sacrifice his own happiness.

This was also the first time that it was really evident that Amy had feelings for Ephram. She would have gone off with him if he hadn't stopped her.
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Old 07-19-2009, 02:41 PM
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I've always thought Vegetative State and John E. Pogue were vastly underrated. For his first episode out, he manages to combine a MEOW, something of a touchy subject, and all of the small-town heartbreak in one episode? That's good.

I loved, as usual, all of the Andy/Nina stuff. From her mock "Freeze in there, you're surrounded" to him being there for her at the school to eventually their talk about when Andy first lost Ephram. Their chemistry was spot on and that last scene made me really appreciate how much we got to see them together, in "parental mode".

Harold and Rose dealing with the pot had me in stiches and gave Rose one of her best deliveries ever!

Rose: What are you looking for Harold?
Harold: Trouble.
Rose: You mean with a capital T that rhymes with P and that stands for Pot?

That and what followed is great comedy. I'm still annoyed Everwood wasn't recognized more for it's humor, cuz it was truly hysterical. And more times than not, better than actual comedies.

Quote:
Tom's acting in the town-meeting when the guy stands up always stands out to me. You see him in the background of the shot, and he's not even able to look the guy in the eye, and he just looks so upset. And he never votes.
I loved this moment. Aside from being a great acting moment, but more than anything, I think it was a great precursor to his handling of the abortion case in Episode 20. You see him initially taking the conservative stance with no room for discussion and then slowly he does the unthinkable and goes in the opposite direction. I love that about his character.
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Old 07-21-2009, 03:56 PM
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I've always thought Vegetative State and John E. Pogue were vastly underrated. For his first episode out, he manages to combine a MEOW, something of a touchy subject, and all of the small-town heartbreak in one episode? That's good.
And his first (credited at least) writing job period. I wish that he was writing more than he does.

And yeah, definitely agreed on how this show was never recognized for being comedic. Come on, it has Tom frickin' Amandes! Heh. That should be enough for people to get that it's a hilarious show. But nooo, it's sappy, and melodramatic.

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I loved this moment. Aside from being a great acting moment, but more than anything, I think it was a great precursor to his handling of the abortion case in Episode 20. You see him initially taking the conservative stance with no room for discussion and then slowly he does the unthinkable and goes in the opposite direction. I love that about his character.
Huh. Good observation! I hadn't quite made that connection before. Now it seems so obvious. *smacks head*

Quote:
This was also the first time that it was really evident that Amy had feelings for Ephram. She would have gone off with him if he hadn't stopped her.
Too true. She was very explicit with how she felt. That's making me think of a question...I'll post it in the Greenies thread.
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Old 07-22-2009, 07:57 PM
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It’s been hard getting myself to write about Season 1. I feel like I’m watching “Gilmore Girls” because the characters are so young, hah.

Loving Dr. Abbott’s reaction to the pot. He’s such a square, it’s hilarious. I think in the 1st season, he comes off as the guy to “not like” but as he grows you learn to love him and his stubborn ways.

So this episode is one of EW’s attempts to address the real life issue of Ritalin and medicinal marijuana. That’s one of the many themes of the show: exposing a perspective by reflecting off the characters. By Dr. Abbott’s change of heart from the protestor in the town hall to offering the pot to the old dude, we can see these issues in a new light. That’s what makes EW so good; it’s always showing us these new perspectives.

Tos, hah yeah, when I saw Sam I thought of that too! There’s an episode before where Ephram is like, “I don’t know how she (old lady who Nina gives baby to) can do that, just give a child away.” The foreshadowing is too strong! I wish I knew how far Berlanti planned to take these characters when he wrote season 1.

Ephram’s reaction to Andy coming to his room reflects that Andy is growing on him. From saying, “What!” then quickly apologizing and asking what Dadio wanted…. It’s these subtle changes that if you notice, you see the characters growing in front of your eyes.

Appreciating the ending… The ephram/andy story always touches me; so the ending of this episode was fitting.

Other than that, those are my main highlights. I’m not that big a fan of the Colin story but it’s a good one nonetheless.
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Old 07-23-2009, 12:43 AM
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Glad to have you back, ChibiT!

Quote:
So this episode is one of EW’s attempts to address the real life issue of Ritalin and medicinal marijuana. That’s one of the many themes of the show: exposing a perspective by reflecting off the characters. By Dr. Abbott’s change of heart from the protestor in the town hall to offering the pot to the old dude, we can see these issues in a new light. That’s what makes EW so good; it’s always showing us these new perspectives.
Agreed, big time. It's especially well done when Dr. Abbott or Dr. Brown is used for those perspectives and sides.

Quote:
Ephram’s reaction to Andy coming to his room reflects that Andy is growing on him. From saying, “What!” then quickly apologizing and asking what Dadio wanted…. It’s these subtle changes that if you notice, you see the characters growing in front of your eyes.
Agreed again. Ephram never would have apologized in the pilot for doing the same thing. In fact, he has done worse things in previous episodes without even considering to give an apology. Although I'm really glad that he did apologize, because man he was such a punk kid before he felt bad and apologized.

And I think I'll be the only one liking most of the Colin stories. I feel so alone!
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Old 07-23-2009, 04:28 AM
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he foreshadowing is too strong! I wish I knew how far Berlanti planned to take these characters when he wrote season 1.
I wonder if Berlanti knew or if it was just a coincidence.


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Appreciating the ending… The ephram/andy story always touches me; so the ending of this episode was fitting.
That ending was so touching and adorable. I love Ephram and Andy together when everything is good.

Quote:
I’m not that big a fan of the Colin story but it’s a good one nonetheless.
Join the club!


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And I think I'll be the only one liking most of the Colin stories. I feel so alone!
That's okay. We all still love you.
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Old 09-16-2009, 10:40 PM
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Hubby and I rewatched this one tonight as well.

I really think this is one of the better eps, beginning to end it's just great. The shift in music as Andy is just about to open the door to the greenhouse in the teaser is just perfect, I was laughing even before he fully realized what was in there.

Having seen far too many kids I know suffer on Ritalin and/or other similar drugs, I was very pleased with the way they handled Sam's storyline. Nina's facial reactions to the preschool teacher brightly complaining about dealing with two dozen highly active children were perfect. I would have loved to have seen her go off on the lady, but I know it wouldn't have been appropriate. Would have been fun though.

Nina also played the nervous parent coming in to see how her child behaved for the babysitter perfectly. I know that wilting feeling when it's confirmed they were completely out of control all too well. You've all read the Calvin and Hobbes comics, right? I think the guy pre-cognitively wrote them about my oldest son.

Mike Erwin deserves an award for his portrayal of Colin, that's all I can say. I mentioned in another thread recently that I really liked Colin (most of the time) and I really felt for him, and man this episode just nails the reason why. From him desperately trying to hide his "cheat sheet" from Amy in the park to him staring stone faced ahead with tears in his eyes as he explained to Bright how hard it is to be "back" but having no idea who he even is, gah. He kills me. Even the subtle way he shifts nervously on the couch when Amy shows up at the end is perfectly done.

The one guy's speech at the town meeting is what really did me in for this episode though. It's been five years ago now that we lost my FIL to pancreatic cancer, and let me tell you every word that guy said was spot on. One of the things I enjoyed most when FIL was alive was cooking for him because he loved my cooking. The last several weeks of his life, he couldn't even eat anything but the minimum it took to keep him alive because the chemo made everything taste so bad he couldn't bear to eat. If I'd had a way to get ahold of some cannabis myself for him just to help him retain some sort of normalcy in the last few weeks, I probably would have done it. The effects of the chemo and meds really is that bad.

Delia: "That kid wears me OUT." HA!
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Old 01-02-2010, 10:12 AM
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I was finally able to watch two other episodes! And I hadn't seen this one before!

First of all... I have been totally surprised that marijuana can be used as medicine. Wow, it was really interesting to hear. I wonder if it's allowed here in Germany as well when a doc give you a recipe.

And Colin finally is back! I haven't seen many episodes with him being out of the hospital but when I heard of the welcome back party for him and saw him in the hospital I was like 'Crap, don't do this, Amy!'. IMO it was totally the wrong thing to do and you got to see it really was when you looked at Colin. Poor him. When he first talked to Amy and he said all this things I wondered if he really can remember a few things but then she found the note in his hand...
But I really like him. He seems totally different from who he used to be and I like this Colin way better. Why that I'll tell you in the next discussion thread (the one of episode 13)

And Ephram! Oh man, I only can say I so love him! I think he has the potential to become my fav character in the show. When he walked home with Amy and told her to be their for Colin, that he needs her and so on... It almost broke my heart to see him (and her). "I wish I would have been the first but I wasn't" was so heartbreaking. Even Amy was speechless and totally touched by his words.

The final scene was one of the best! When Amy went to Colin and told him he should get to know her again and he'd recognize who she is and that he'd like her again. When she said "I'm Amy" and gave his hand to him and he answered "I'm Colin" and took her hand was great!

I felt sorry for Nina during this episode as well. Andy finally recognized that her son only misses his dad... No disease or so he would need Ritalin for. I was like shocked when I heard the teacher of Sam talk to Andy and Nina! Stupid teacher!
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Old 01-02-2010, 11:21 AM
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I
And Ephram! Oh man, I only can say I so love him! I think he has the potential to become my fav character in the show. When he walked home with Amy and told her to be their for Colin, that he needs her and so on... It almost broke my heart to see him (and her). "I wish I would have been the first but I wasn't" was so heartbreaking. Even Amy was speechless and totally touched by his words.
Oh, Ephram was my favorite character on the show. I just loved him in this scene. He was only thinking of Amy...not of himself. It was so obvious that Amy wanted Ephram in this scene....all he had to do was say the word and she would have left with him. Ephram had so much integrity...he knew that Amy needed to go off and help Colin.


Quote:
I was like shocked when I heard the teacher of Sam talk to Andy and Nina! Stupid teacher!

This show really made all of the teachers seem stupid! Remember Delia's teacher...season one?
It makes you wonder about the teaching profession.
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Old 01-02-2010, 03:18 PM
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Gaah, had a massively long post about this ep all typed up & then I accidentally clicked somewhere & it disappeared! Maybe my rambling caused a malfunction?
I adore this ep, and I realised I was addicted to the show when I stayed up til the early hours to watch it, as the channel I viewed the show on decided that its content was not suitable to be broadcast during the working day!
I thought Sam's pre school teacher was quite evidently in the wrong line of work, as was the patronising & backward-thinking Miss Violet! As someone who wants to go into teaching, it pained me to see two people showcasing the profession so badly!
Also, if the info about the effects of Ritalin on little people that the show used is correct, well, that's just frightening!
I have to say I totally missed TA's reaction & non-vote at the council meeting, so I'll have to rewatch the ep for that, not that that's a hardship or anything! I also didn't notice how his change of stance also echoes the abortion ep & his views on that...
I have difficulty imagining Ephram being as rambunctious & energetic as Sam when he was the same age, as I think of him as a much shyer, introverted little boy who had relatively quiet artistic pursuits. Pergaps he held back at school & let loose at home? I can definitely see him as highly inquisitive & very loquacious, so I can imagine his responses to his parents' questions must have been a lot like Sam's when Andy asks Sam if he sees a lot of his Dad ("Yeah, all the time, except for sometimes... When he comes back we're gonna go for pizza or ice cream, or maybe pizza and ice cream, 'cause he likes both & we'll go to the park, but you can't come 'cause you're not my Daddy & it's just us...")-the writers totally nailed writing an over-excited child there, hee!
Andy's story to Nina about losing Ephram was so sad! I can just imagine little 5/6 year old Ephram being all forgiving for the first time Andy missed going to the arcade with him, then him just getting more & more miserable every subsequent Saturday. I can picture him getting all excited every time he heard a car stop outside the house or footsteps/noises in the corridor leading to the front door of their apartment and asking Julia when is Daddy going to take me to the arcade, is it nearly time yet, then segue-ing where his Daddy is, what time is it & why didn't he remember. Then there'd be tears, I'm sure... Then, later, confusion & hurt at Andy's solution of throwing money at the problem by buying Ephram a pinball machine when all he really wants is some attention & affection from his dad!
The end of the ep makes me smile as it's awesome to see how much Ephram & Andy actually understand eachother-they get the other's unique brand of humour and have this phenomenal bond when they're not at eachother's throats!
I adore how noble & selfless is regarding his feelings for Amy, and this ep really manages to convey just how much he loves her!

Last edited by Louisa C; 01-02-2010 at 03:23 PM
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Old 01-02-2010, 05:04 PM
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Louisa, I love the way that you describe the characters' feelings.. (no, it's not rambling!) Poor Ephram..I never thought of Andy's neglect played out in Ephram's mind. I love reading your thoughts.


Quote:
Perhaps he held back at school & let loose at home?
There is one comment that I don't understand (made by Andy to Ephram in the pilot after Ephram's fight with Bright)...." You know, Ephram, I thought you'd change. I thought that if we moved here, you'd stop with the fighting. With the acting out"

What did that statement mean? Was Ephram involved in a lot of fights in NY?
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