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Old 06-24-2010, 09:20 AM
  #61
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If Bright didn't try to get Ephram away from Amy in the first few episodes, do you think Amy would have told Ephram about Colin on her own? With Bright getting in the way, it seemed she was forced to tell Ephram the truth since Bright constantly called her out on it in front of everyone.
Wow, interesting question. I don't really have an answer yet. Will think on it a bit.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:20 AM
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I should've asked the question after thinking about it. Maybe if asked if Ephram moved away for like a month or maybe they did something where was gone for a long time, like a few months. I don't know. I'm just wondering what would happen if Ephram got what he wanted. Got to move back to his grandparents and decided that he wanted Everwood too, like Everwood may not be so bad, what would happen then? We know that Amy didn't want him to move, but she would never come out and say that. So, I guess that might be a new question. I don't know. But I do have a new question since the previous one, that didn't make entirely a lot of sense
Don't sell yourself short, Patricia. That was a great question. Really made me think about how one event would have brought down so many characters. Kind of a depressing question, though.

But, yeah, that's a good question too, if Ephram would have missed Everwood, missed his family maybe. I've always wondered that myself, actually. Would he have really left forever? I don't even know the answer to that one!

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If Bright didn't try to get Ephram away from Amy in the first few episodes, do you think Amy would have told Ephram about Colin on her own? With Bright getting in the way, it seemed she was forced to tell Ephram the truth since Bright constantly called her out on it in front of everyone.


Huh. Never thought of that before. I think she would have told him, yes. I think she wanted to. Plus, she did want Andy to perform the surgery, so she would have had to tell him to get his dad to do it. But I think she would have liked doing it in a very different way. On her own terms, without hurting Ephram's feelings.
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Old 06-24-2010, 03:50 PM
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If Bright didn't try to get Ephram away from Amy in the first few episodes, do you think Amy would have told Ephram about Colin on her own? With Bright getting in the way, it seemed she was forced to tell Ephram the truth since Bright constantly called her out on it in front of everyone.

Great question, Patricia!!

I agree with 'Tos. She didn't want to tell Ephram right away...she was kind of playing him...using him (not thinking that she might become interested in him)...she would have had to tell him about Colin eventually so that he would get the surgery.
Of course, Bright's actions forced the issue and sped up the process.
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Old 06-24-2010, 09:51 PM
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I guess I'll answer my own question

I think it would have been a lot better for Colin's news to come from Amy. Since she was the bold one to ask Ephram to talk to Andy about performing the surgery. But she couldn't tell him that she was his girlfriend, even though Colin had been in Denver for months. I think, from the beginning of Ephram being at County High, Amy knew there was something there. Plus, a small town, new kid in school...it's intriguing. She knew he was a good guy and because Colin wasn't there, she allowed herself to let him in. But it wasn't fair, not to Ephram nor to Amy to allow this to happen. She played everyone, including herself and Ephram just tagged along like a lost puppy dog.

But all in all, I think Amy liked the idea of Ephram being there. You know, him being the only one to show up for Colin's surgery, the first one. Out of everyone Amy's met in he entire life, everyone who supposedly loved Colin Hart. And telling Ephram about Colin from day one would put a big difference between them. He wouldn't be so giving to Amy. He would've backed off. But Amy, I beleive, wanted to be Ephram's girlfriend, but was so devoted to being the girlfriend of the great Colin Hart, she couldn't. She, for a while, had the best of both worlds.
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:26 PM
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But it wasn't fair, not to Ephram nor to Amy to allow this to happen. She played everyone, including herself and Ephram just tagged along like a lost puppy dog.
Do you think Amy ever felt bad during these early episodes about using Ephram? Because she was starting to connect with him and starting to really see how different he really was and how she was liking that. Do you think she, too, knew it was unfair?

Because we see in those early episodes, "Deer God" or the episode where Ephram leaves Amy crying in the library, that Ephram doesn't feel good about lying to Amy. I think Amy feels the same way with her situation. I really think so. But do we see it in the same way? Or is it maybe an unfair comparison because Ephram doesn't have someone he needs to get Amy to save?

*rubs chin*
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:39 PM
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Do you think Amy ever felt bad during these early episodes about using Ephram? Because she was starting to connect with him and starting to really see how different he really was and how she was liking that. Do you think she, too, knew it was unfair?
*
Amy definitely felt bad when her friends were disinviting Ephram to Kayla's birthday party. She was mortified as they made such stupid excuses and Ephram stood there nodding while he was totally on to them. Amy couldn't even look Ephram in the face. Of course.....later with the help of Edna.....she realized how wrong it was and that she couldn't go to that party.
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Old 06-28-2010, 08:55 PM
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Amy definitely felt bad when her friends were disinviting Ephram to Kayla's birthday party. She was mortified as they made such stupid excuses and Ephram stood there nodding while he was totally on to them. Amy couldn't even look Ephram in the face. Of course.....later with the help of Edna.....she realized how wrong it was and that she couldn't go to that party.
Which is why Amy was my favorite character and I could relate so much to her realness. She was so flawed in the earlier seasons but she always eventually did the right thing, making the right choices or feeling appropriately about things in the end. I know some people think Amy was the spoiled brat, Amy was this, Amy was that... but was she really? Did she really have an easy, wonderful life? I don't think so. How many girls her age have to deal with a boyfriend who is a vegetable from a car accident involving her brother? She basically loses Colin twice. Once after he comes back, again when he ultimately dies. It's no wonder this girl had flaws running all around her. There's no way she could possibly psychologically handle all of those serious issues without having symptoms as a result. She handled things even better than one would expect to be honest. As for her popular group of friends... she never felt comfortable with those friends. It was all an association type of thing but outside of Laynie she never had deep friendships with any of those people. I think Ephram knew Amy was different from her friends from the start or else he wouldn't have fallen for her. Ephram was wise. Ephram knew what he was getting himself into regarding Colin, Ephram knew Amy was not the spoiled, popular girl that it would appear on the surface. There were layers to Amy and that is what he saw in her.

I went a bit OT, sorry about that. My Amy love tends to do that to me and that has never changed for years, heh.
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Old 06-28-2010, 09:26 PM
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I agree with that pretty much 100%, Michelle. I think they explained most of Amy's flaws quite well. Plus, Ephram and Andy were incredibly flawed too. That's the fun, I think. They all needed to start off as very flawed to get to a place later in the seasons where they would be growing and changing some of those flaws. And I think we saw that with Amy, whether it be her relationship with Harold in the later seasons, or Hannah, or Ephram. There were marked differences from how she interacted or would interact with those characters from S1 to after S2.

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Amy definitely felt bad when her friends were disinviting Ephram to Kayla's birthday party. She was mortified as they made such stupid excuses and Ephram stood there nodding while he was totally on to them. Amy couldn't even look Ephram in the face. Of course.....later with the help of Edna.....she realized how wrong it was and that she couldn't go to that party.
Oh, yeah, that's for sure. You could just feel the cringe Amy would be having later on. Brutal scene!

It's just interesting that we actually directly saw Ephram feel bad more often, even though we all knew Amy did. And Emily did a good job with a small look here or there right after she would do something mean to Ephram that she regretted it. Nice acting job.
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Old 06-28-2010, 09:43 PM
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Do you think Amy ever felt bad during these early episodes about using Ephram? Because she was starting to connect with him and starting to really see how different he really was and how she was liking that. Do you think she, too, knew it was unfair?
I think Amy was just horribly conflicted and confused and on top of it, felt guilty because she really began to genuinely fall for Ephram when she was supposed to be so OMG!Totally!Devoted!toColin! Honestly, I don't think she ever really used Ephram at all, at least not from her perspective. It's not like she tricked him into getting her pregnant and then dumped him or anything soap opera-ish like that. She just genuinely saw the Browns moving to EW as some sort of divine answer to prayer but then things got sticky emotionally when it came to actually asking (through Ephram) for Andy to help.

And, really, how was she supposed to live with herself if she had decided that she liked Ephram too much to ruin their friendship/relationship and just let Colin continue to lay there without ever broaching the topic with Ephram or Andy? The Harts would have eventually pulled the plug, and then Amy would have to deal with knowing that there might have been a real chance that something could have been done to save Colin's life but she just...kept her mouth shut because she had a crush on someone else. That's a heavy burden to lay on someone.
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Old 06-28-2010, 11:16 PM
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Do you think Amy ever felt bad during these early episodes about using Ephram? Because she was starting to connect with him and starting to really see how different he really was and how she was liking that. Do you think she, too, knew it was unfair?

Because we see in those early episodes, "Deer God" or the episode where Ephram leaves Amy crying in the library, that Ephram doesn't feel good about lying to Amy. I think Amy feels the same way with her situation. I really think so. But do we see it in the same way? Or is it maybe an unfair comparison because Ephram doesn't have someone he needs to get Amy to save?

*rubs chin*
Amy had to have seen the consequences of her actions. She was leading Ephram on, letting him think that there was a future with her. But she always went to Colin. But she did it so many times and Ephram went along with it most of time, maybe she stopped feeling bad about it and just went with the flow?

I just can't see how Amy doing what she did and not realizing that her thing with Ephram would get a lot more complicated once Colin woke up.
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Old 07-01-2010, 04:08 PM
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And, really, how was she supposed to live with herself if she had decided that she liked Ephram too much to ruin their friendship/relationship and just let Colin continue to lay there without ever broaching the topic with Ephram or Andy? The Harts would have eventually pulled the plug, and then Amy would have to deal with knowing that there might have been a real chance that something could have been done to save Colin's life but she just...kept her mouth shut because she had a crush on someone else. That's a heavy burden to lay on someone.
Good point about the Harts eventually pulling the plug. I think, either way, we get a S2 Amy if Colin dies. She's always going fall apart, whether he wakes up and reconnects with her in some fashion as we got, or he never wakes up. It's heartbreaking for Amy either way.
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Old 06-30-2018, 03:15 AM
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Ephram playing the piano at the beginning was really cool.

Seeing the flashbacks with Ephram and his mom were really sweet. And you can completely get why Ephram had so much anger with his dad. His mom was always there for him when Andy bailed so when she died, ugh, that was probably so rough. Watching his mom help him out with the "Gwen Stefani" girl was really cute. It was so hard watching Ephram tell his mom to leave Andy. I can see why he wanted her to! And even though its horribly sad that she died, in a way it was the best thing for Andy to realize that he had to be a better father to his kids.

Finding out that his mother was the one that had the affair, not Andy definitely put things in perspective and made you sympathize with Andy a bit more, understanding why he had to leave but also getting why the affair happened to begin with.

Colin getting mad at Amy was really annoying because really dude, you want to ignore your issues and pretend like you aren't sick? I realize he's scared to discover that he's still having issues but its better to know as early as possible. His parents dismissing Andy as their doctor was so rude too, like come on, take him seriously. So frustrating. Amy's outburst at her dad after that was totally uncool. But, its obvious everyone is just scared about Colin.

This was a great episode, so much going on and so hearty and emotional.
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Old 06-30-2018, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Alexa (View Post)
118:

Ephram playing the piano at the beginning was really cool.

Seeing the flashbacks with Ephram and his mom were really sweet. And you can completely get why Ephram had so much anger with his dad. His mom was always there for him when Andy bailed so when she died, ugh, that was probably so rough. Watching his mom help him out with the "Gwen Stefani" girl was really cute. It was so hard watching Ephram tell his mom to leave Andy. I can see why he wanted her to! And even though its horribly sad that she died, in a way it was the best thing for Andy to realize that he had to be a better father to his kids.

Finding out that his mother was the one that had the affair, not Andy definitely put things in perspective and made you sympathize with Andy a bit more, understanding why he had to leave but also getting why the affair happened to begin with.

Colin getting mad at Amy was really annoying because really dude, you want to ignore your issues and pretend like you aren't sick? I realize he's scared to discover that he's still having issues but its better to know as early as possible. His parents dismissing Andy as their doctor was so rude too, like come on, take him seriously. So frustrating. Amy's outburst at her dad after that was totally uncool. But, its obvious everyone is just scared about Colin.

This was a great episode, so much going on and so hearty and emotional.
This is one of my favorite Everwood episodes of all time. This episode is classic Everwood and why it sets itself apart from the vast majority of shows. Pure excellence.

The affair, flashbacks, Ephram/Andy interaction (and ultimate understanding) was so well done. Treat and Greg just lit it up.

I feel for Amy so much. Colin's fears are understandable but it's a hell on earth for Amy and everyone around him. His parents are complete jerks too. Denial makes sense but you need to put your son first and make sure he's receiving ever ounce of follow up care possible.

But yes, this episode was so good.
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