Everwood - Everwood Fans who are Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie Fans of Dawson's Creek #29: Williamson wrote the Series Finale and admitted even his Mother hated it.

**jediwands** · 02-03-2021, 12:16 AM

This is an appreciation thread for Everwood fans who are also Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie fans. For those who shipped these pairings, the series once had such great promise, but ended up being one of the most disappointing series to date. TPTB enjoyed manipulating the heart and soul of the old school (seasons 1/2) Dawson's Creek audience, who embraced the premise and the main pairings of the show; Dawson/Joey and Pacey/Andie fans. The first two seasons defined Dawson's Creek. Season 3 came along and the show simply wasn't the same anymore. New showrunner who essentially mocked the premise, destroyed the main pairings, and was basically just fine with dropping the quality in order to make the series his own. We know the drill. Discussing our main pairings, as well frustrations over storylines, writing, TPTB, fandom in general, is all welcome here.

Note: This is not a debate thread with other ships. This thread is strictly for Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie fans to appreciate the pairings and discuss aspects of the show, both good and bad. This thread was originally created to celebrate friendships between a couple of regulars on the Everwood board who, back in the day, posted on the Dawson's Creek board and encountered some terrible fan wars and not so great moments. We wanted a safe place to discuss our thoughts here on the Everwood board. That is how this thread was created. Jerry D, our amazing Administrator, and my very good friend, came up with the idea and the rest is history. For those of you who ship other pairings and don't agree with the content of this thread, of course there's the Dawson's Creek board and other threads scattered throughout Fan Forum perfectly designed for you.

Thanks!

Credit Xelphia Kenny:

Alternate S5 & S6 : He made a solemn promise he would come and visit her. Hell, he even jotted it down in indelible black ink onto the crisp pages of her brand new journal while wearing a big toothy grin on his face, but regardless, it had been months since Pacey had made any contact with Andie. Andie forced herself not to overthink it and chalked it up to life getting in the way, but the smallest embers inside of her heart that yearned for him still despite everything that happened between them started to prickle at the back of her head. Although once the orientation process at Harvard was over and the real work began, Andie’s thoughts of Pacey Witter were sidelined in order to make room for the mountains and mountains of schoolwork she was receiving on a daily basis.

That was until, out of the blue, Pacey literally came sailing back into her life looking tanned, well rested, and even more gorgeous. Andie vowed to never let herself fall back in love with Pacey, she made an ironclad pledge to herself to never stray back into that hornet’s nest, but his soft, warm gaze pointed in her direction had Andie convinced his heart was remembering the way it used to love her.

She was one hundred percent correct in her assumptions.

The laughter between them settled into a deep warmth and easiness, and they talked well into the wee hours of the night and gradually, the intimacy they once coveted as a couple so long ago had returned to their bodies in triplicate. It started with Pacey’s hand brushing up against hers when she handed him a magazine from a convenience store shelf, which then evolved into their hugs becoming longer and more needy each time they touched. Soon enough, Pacey did the unthinkable, and asked Andie a question she never thought she’d hear again in her life from him…

Pacey Witter had asked her out on a date.

At first, they had both agreed to not invest too much of themselves into the date, stating an urge to take things as slow as they could in order to protect themselves from any harmful fallout, but Pacey and Andie’s mutually intense bedroom eyes that screamed “make love to me.” seemed to tell another story altogether. The immense pain of potentially opening up old wounds over how their relationship crumbled in the past fell to the wayside as Pacey and Andie ended up having passionate, raw, soul searing sex in Andie’s shower. Every single iota of mistrust, devastating heartbreak, and bad memories in their past circled its way down the drain.

And as Andie sat by her vanity, drying her hair and watching Pacey getting ready for bed, she smiled to herself. At long last, she finally felt like she could breathe again.

Fic Links that TL22 supplied and commented on:

1.Kiss Me Chapter 1, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

This takes place at the end of season four. It's my very first P/A story. two short chapters. My version on how the graduation could/should have went.

2.Thanksgiving, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

A short interlude of what could have happened between seasons three and four.

3.Finding True Love Chapter 1, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

Fourteen chapters of what could have happened in the future. I wrote it over two years. The story starts season three when Pacey is getting ready to sail away. The end of chapter one has a unique twist, I think you'll enjoy.

The following is by ElizabethBella who wrote a fantastic Pacey/Andie story. (My favourite)

Come Sail Away Chapter 1: Separate, and apart, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
This is a multi chaptered story, you won't be able to put down.

The next is another one of my favourites written by the very talented StevieLuvsAlex

No amount of time, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

The next is a two part Pacey/Andie story written by me and StevieLuvsAlex. The first part is hers and the second part written by me won't make any sense if the first part is not read. Very very short

Everything happens for a reason, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
Written by StevieluvsAlex

Everything Happens For a Reason part Two, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
Written by me and takes up where Everything Happens For a Reason leaves off

https://www.fanfiction.net/story/sto...toryid=7420836

This is a glimpse of Pacey, Andie, Joey and Dawson when they were very young. The story is two parts..

The next link is by the author Makesmyheadspin. IT is a bitter sweet story and really captures Pacey and Andie.

Fate is The Hunter, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

Fan Fic Written by Jerry:
Ghosts

Relapse

WHY I WILL NEVER BE A FAN OF PACEY / JOEY

The first two links will take you to a collection of D/J stories and the last link to a collection of P/A stories:

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...nd-Joey/27781/

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...-Always/33166/

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...Fanfics/45942//

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/2101505/1/Wandering-Heart

**jediwands** · 02-03-2021, 12:28 AM

Last Page of Posts on Previous Thread

**jediwands** · 02-03-2021, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM01 (View Post)

That is revolting. Thank you for explaining it so I don't have to sit through a scene like that!

P.S. the bolded part I totally read in her voice

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM01 (View Post)

That's exactly what it felt like. I just cannot bring myself to feel as if it was anything more than that. Nothing near the level of the deep, genuine, 'I can't live without you' kind of love that DJ portrayed in my opinion.

Completely agree.

PJ got together in the first place due being hurt over Dawson and Andie. The end of S3 should have been both realizing they confused romantic feelings with friendship because they were still not over Dawson and Andie. Same thing could have been revealed in S4 too. Joey was obvious about not being over Dawson in S4 anyway. I just never felt any deep romantic true love between PJ. They did not balance each other out and fought all the time. DJ balanced each other out and PA blew PJ out of the water too.

***Jerry D*** · 02-03-2021, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

Completely agree.

PJ got together in the first place due being hurt over Dawson and Andie. The end of S3 should have been both realizing they confused romantic feelings with friendship because they were still not over Dawson and Andie. Same thing could have been revealed in S4 too. Joey was obvious about not being over Dawson in S4 anyway. I just never felt any deep romantic true love between PJ. They did not balance each other out and fought all the time. DJ balanced each other out and PA blew PJ out of the water too.

I completely agree with all of this. Pacey and Joey were a completely mismatched couple and their relationship was based on deception, betrayal, and the breach of an unwritten trust among friends, and neither Pacey or Joey were ever able to “exorcise” Dawson Leery’s “ghost” from their relationship. We saw Pacey make sneering comments about Dawson to Joey time and time again, and we saw Joey denigrate her relationship with Dawson to assuage Pacey’s never ending insecurities about Joey’s feelings for Dawson, but we’ve never seen them get past their “Dawson” issues, even though he completely stayed out of their relationship.

We saw Joey tell Pacey time and time again that she was completely over Dawson, but then we saw her react in an extremely jealous way whenever she saw Dawson and Gretchen together, even to the point where she tried to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship before it really had a chance to begin, and we then saw Pacey try to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship because he saw that it bothered Joey that they were together.

Therefore, from the beginning to the end, Pacey and Joey’s had failure written all over it.

**jediwands** · 02-03-2021, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

I completely agree with all of this. Pacey and Joey were a completely mismatched couple and their relationship was based on deception, betrayal, and the breach of an unwritten trust among friends, and neither Pacey or Joey were ever able to “exorcise” Dawson Leery’s “ghost” from their relationship.

So well said. That’s the precise summary.

I find it interesting that even the pathetic series finale ended with Joey talking to Dawson.

Quote:

We saw Pacey make sneering comments about Dawson to Joey time and time again, and we saw Joey denigrate her relationship with Dawson to assuage Pacey’s never ending insecurities about Joey’s feelings for Dawson, but we’ve never seen them get past their “Dawson” issues, even though he completely stayed out of their relationship.

PJers found a way to still blame Dawson too.

Think about how pathetic Pacey was to go behind Dawson’s back, hurt him in the worst possible way... then indirectly blame him for why he was never happy and couldn’t make it work with Joey. Pacey turned into such an annoying, even despicable, character.

Quote:

We saw Joey tell Pacey time and time again that she was completely over Dawson, but then we saw her react in an extremely jealous way whenever she saw Dawson and Gretchen together, even to the point where she tried to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship before it really had a chance to begin, and we then saw Pacey try to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship because he saw that it bothered Joey that they were together.

Therefore, from the beginning to the end, Pacey and Joey’s had failure written all over it.

100%, which is why even their tacked on ending, stealing DJ lines, did nothing to make this pairing believable.

RM01 · 02-03-2021, 11:43 PM

In response to the topic in the previous thread about whether people felt threatened by PJ (wasn't able to respond as the thread reached its limit), I didn't feel threatened by PJ but I think what was threatening was the fact that Josh and Katie dated in real life which I think would have had a lot to do with the PJ ending.

And LOL at the thread title.

RM01 · 02-04-2021, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

I completely agree with all of this. Pacey and Joey were a completely mismatched couple and their relationship was based on deception, betrayal, and the breach of an unwritten trust among friends, and neither Pacey or Joey were ever able to “exorcise” Dawson Leery’s “ghost” from their relationship.

Excellently put. No matter how hard they tried, they were never able to overcome the massive impact that Dawson had on their relationship. A cloud constantly hanging over their head. I think Pacey tried so hard to deny this and I think because he slowly started realising he was wrong, it made him more resentful because no matter how much he tried, the idea of Dawson and Joey being close was something he couldn't handle. And he knew that Dawson and Joey shared something between each other that they didn't with anybody else and that's probably what made Pacey more angry. That Dawson had something over him that he could never get. That Dawson was able to touch a part of her soul that Pacey never could. Time and time again we see Pacey wanting Joey to love him like she loves Dawson. A specific moment I recall, and I can't remember which episode it was but he said something like can you love me like a soulmate, along the lines of that. He so badly wanted her to transfer that love that she had for Dawson onto him so that he could feel like he was truly loved more than Dawson.

And you're right, Dawson's impact on their relationship was never addressed in the end which makes me think it would never be addressed and since it it's not healthy to keep stuff like that in the background of a relationship, I think the next logical thing that would happen is they would eventually break up because that kind of baggage that isn't addressed is hard to get through especially if one of the parties continues to pursue the friendship with the person that the insecurities are about.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

We saw Pacey make sneering comments about Dawson to Joey time and time again, and we saw Joey denigrate her relationship with Dawson to assuage Pacey’s never ending insecurities about Joey’s feelings for Dawson, but we’ve never seen them get past their “Dawson” issues, even though he completely stayed out of their relationship.

It goes to show that even by completely staying out of their relationship, look how much of an impact he had on PJ just by his mere existence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

We saw Joey tell Pacey time and time again that she was completely over Dawson, but then we saw her react in an extremely jealous way whenever she saw Dawson and Gretchen together, even to the point where she tried to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship before it really had a chance to begin, and we then saw Pacey try to sabotage Dawson and Gretchen’s relationship because he saw that it bothered Joey that they were together.

Therefore, from the beginning to the end, Pacey and Joey’s had failure written all over it.

I had no idea they tried to sabotage in Dawson and Gretchen's relationship (since I skipped most of season 4). They really stooped that low, Pacey and Joey lol.

**jediwands** · 02-04-2021, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM01 (View Post)

In response to the topic in the previous thread about whether people felt threatened by PJ (wasn't able to respond as the thread reached its limit), I didn't feel threatened by PJ but I think what was threatening was the fact that Josh and Katie dated in real life which I think would have had a lot to do with the PJ ending.

And LOL at the thread title.

I love how Kevin’s mom spoke for us.

Yea, for many PJers, some had difficulty separating Josh/Katie from Pacey/Joey. It was... kind of bizarre.

TPTB loved the triangle wars. They lived for them. I also think they were dumb enough to believe the PJ loud Internet fans who manipulated Internet polls = a large fanbase. They were not a large fanbase. Numbers and ratings don’t lie. The ratings went down when things went from DJ/PA to PJ.

TL22 · 02-04-2021, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RM01 (View Post)

In response to the topic in the previous thread about whether people felt threatened by PJ (wasn't able to respond as the thread reached its limit), I didn't feel threatened by PJ but I think what was threatening was the fact that Josh and Katie dated in real life which I think would have had a lot to do with the PJ ending.

And LOL at the thread title.

I don't think Josh and Katie dating had a direct effect on the end. I think their dating ended before season two. What it did effect was the Pacey/Joey fan base. There is/was a group of fans who when they found out that Josh and Katie dated, they had to be together on the series as well. This group was very vocal and internet savvy. So indirectly they affected the series ending. I also think the availability of Meredith Monroe affected the series ending, and definitely Stupin more so than anything caused the series ending.

Interestingly the same thing happened on Gilmore Girls. Milo Ventimiglia (Jess) and Alexis Bledel (Rory) dated off screen. Which caused a very vocal group of fans to advocate their on screen romance.

I like the thread title. Very apt.

***Jerry D*** · 02-04-2021, 03:48 PM

Dawson's Creek was the first show to use the Internet as a marketing tool, and as such internet fans had a real influence on the show, and as Tony mentioned some of the Pacey and Joey fans were Internet savvy and they rigged some polls that made Pacey and Joey look more popular than they were.

***Jerry D*** · 02-04-2021, 09:59 PM

Some great news about Michelle Williams:

https://deadline.com/2021/02/michell...sh-1234685936/

I love how they don't mention Dawson's Creek when they write about her. Rather than mention that, they mention that she's a four-time Academy Award nominee and a Golden Globe winner.

I'd say it's safe to say that she's doing better than the washed up former "It Girl" of the show!

The idiot writers and producers placed their bets on the wrong actress!

**jediwands** · 02-04-2021, 10:25 PM

I remember reading that Michelle Williams questioned the decision to kill off Jen, wondering what would happen if a reunion show or movie happened to which Williamson replied she would be a ghost.

How does he not feel stupid after this? A reunion or movie is 100% out of the question. Even the thought of it makes Williamson look even more stupid having an award winning actress on his show and never took advantage of her talent and ended up killing off her character. Not to mention the money they lost not being able to do a revival or movie. Karma is real.

COOLCAT200 · 02-04-2021, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

I remember reading that Michelle Williams questioned the decision to kill off Jen, wondering what would happen if a reunion show or movie happened to which Williamson replied she would be a ghost.

How does he not feel stupid after this? A reunion or movie is 100% out of the question. Even the thought of it makes Williamson look even more stupid having an award winning actress on his show and never took advantage of her talent and ended up killing off her character. Not to mention the money they lost not being able to do a revival or movie. Karma is real.

Even if D/J ended up together I would still be upset he killed Jen off. She deserved a happy ending.

**jediwands** · 02-04-2021, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

Even if D/J ended up together I would still be upset he killed Jen off. She deserved a happy ending.

I’m so with you. The character was used and abused from day 1 then they finish her off in the series finale. I cannot believe her dying wish was for basically Joey to make a choice. She has a beautiful little daughter she’s leaving, a best friend in Jack she adores, a Grandmother she was so close to they were basically mother/daughter but her dying wish was focused on a triangle that had no business being a triangle in the first place.

COOLCAT200 · 02-05-2021, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

I’m so with you. The character was used and abused from day 1 then they finish her off in the series finale. I cannot believe her dying wish was for basically Joey to make a choice. She has a beautiful little daughter she’s leaving, a best friend in Jack she adores, a Grandmother she was so close to they were basically mother/daughter but her dying wish was focused on a triangle that had no business being a triangle in the first place.

100% agree. I could understand maybe killing Grams off, but not Jen. It’s my birthday, it’s crazy to think when the show premiered it was during my freshmen year of high school.

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Fan Forum > TV Shows - Past > Everwood > Everwood Fans who are Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie Fans of Dawson's Creek #29: Williamson wrote the Series Finale and admitted even his Mother hated it.