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Old 06-24-2020, 04:50 PM
  #136
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It sort of reminded me of Ephram and Madison and how mothering Madison was to Ephram (even though she was immature herself) and yet they slept together...
Please, I just ate!

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Yes, so true, Jerry, about the miscasting of some characters. It is like Kevin concentrated on some of the characters and other ones he couldn't have cared less. Oliver Hudson was clearly on the show because he shares genes with his mother and sister.
I know that the actress who played Bessie, Nina Repeta, went to East Carolina University with Kevin Williamson, so it's obvious that he cast her in Dawson's Creek due to his friendship with her, because she really wasn't very talented at all.

Side note: I read that the actor who played Bodie, Obi Ndefo, had both of his legs amputated when he was hit from behind by a drunk driver last year.

Story: https://news.yale.edu/2020/01/22/daw...leads-new-role
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Old 06-24-2020, 05:45 PM
  #137
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Please, I just ate!


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I know that the actress who played Bessie, Nina Repeta, went to East Carolina University with Kevin Williamson, so it's obvious that he cast her in Dawson's Creek due to his friendship with her, because she really wasn't very talented at all.
Of course. Ridiculous since he only hurt his own work. Give her a quick cameo but not a prominent secondary role.

There's some really bad actors on this show. Some talent but more bad than good actors. Contagious too, since even John Wesley Shipp wasn't very good as Mitch yet he was great in both Flash roles.

Quote:
Side note: I read that the actor who played Bodie, Obi Ndefo, had both of his legs amputated when he was hit from behind by a drunk driver last year.

Story: https://news.yale.edu/2020/01/22/daw...leads-new-role
That is awful.
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Old 06-27-2020, 06:34 PM
  #138
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I have a couple of questions.

1. Do you think Pacey ever truly fell out of love with Andie?

2. Do you think Pacey and Joey was love or an infatuation?

3. True love, which could be the alternative title for Dawson's Creek; which couples on Dawson's Creek really had true love?

I'll give my opinions later.
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Old 06-27-2020, 06:50 PM
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A great Pacey/Andie picture.

It's amazing t age 30 she easily passes for 17.

https://www.usmagazine.com/wp-conten...reek.jpg?w=660
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Old 06-27-2020, 08:13 PM
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A great Pacey/Andie picture.

It's amazing t age 30 she easily passes for 17.

https://www.usmagazine.com/wp-conten...reek.jpg?w=660
Love this picture. She certainly did pass for that age. Katie never could have played Joey at 30.
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Old 06-27-2020, 08:16 PM
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I have a couple of questions.

1. Do you think Pacey ever truly fell out of love with Andie?

2. Do you think Pacey and Joey was love or an infatuation?

3. True love, which could be the alternative title for Dawson's Creek; which couples on Dawson's Creek really had true love?

I'll give my opinions later.
I'm thinking.
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Old 06-28-2020, 02:56 AM
  #142
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1. Do you think Pacey ever truly fell out of love with Andie?
No. He was angry/hurt and basically avoided his feelings. He used hanging out with Joey as a distraction. This is why I've always maintained a great storyline would have been the realization for both Pacey and Joey that they confused a friendship with romantic feelings. They both were there for each other during tough times (attempting to get over Dawson and Andie) but it was friendship, not romantic. Then DJ and PA could have reunited at the end of season 3/beginning of season 4.

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2. Do you think Pacey and Joey was love or an infatuation?
I honestly think they were together because Pacey still wasn't completely over the pain with Andie and Joey liked that she could basically boss Pacey around in a very unbalanced relationship. She liked that she felt "better" than him. It helped her ego. Even though both PA and DJ balanced each other out nicely. PJ was the definition of unbalanced.

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3. True love, which could be the alternative title for Dawson's Creek; which couples on Dawson's Creek really had true love?
DJ and PA. It was artificially erased to facilitate PJ but the audience with awareness understood the first two seasons had real love between DJ and PA. Kevin left and disaster followed.
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Old 06-30-2020, 11:23 AM
  #143
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1.
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No. He was angry/hurt and basically avoided his feelings. He used hanging out with Joey as a distraction. This is why I've always maintained a great storyline would have been the realization for both Pacey and Joey that they confused a friendship with romantic feelings. They both were there for each other during tough times (attempting to get over Dawson and Andie) but it was friendship, not romantic. Then DJ and PA could have reunited at the end of season 3/beginning of season 4.
I agree.

2.
Quote:
I honestly think they were together because Pacey still wasn't completely over the pain with Andie and Joey liked that she could basically boss Pacey around in a very unbalanced relationship. She liked that she felt "better" than him. It helped her ego. Even though both PA and DJ balanced each other out nicely. PJ was the definition of unbalanced.
I agree.

3.
Quote:
DJ and PA. It was artificially erased to facilitate PJ but the audience with awareness understood the first two seasons had real love between DJ and PA. Kevin left and disaster followed.
I sort of have to disagree with DJ. I'd say for the first two seasons yes. The next two sort of. The final two seasons, no. I know the series was supposed to be about DJ true love, but the writers screwed that up and at the end of the series I don't think Joey really cared what Dawson thought or did. I think Jen and Jack had a form of true love. Instead of killing Jen it would have been nice for them to end up as a couple, but as we know KW made Jack gay. The beginning of the end of the series.
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Old 06-30-2020, 12:49 PM
  #144
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Kevin Williamson was just fine allowing Dawson/Joey to be destroyed. They were hardly even friends in the last couple of seasons. But for me, I'm with Berlanti... they should have ended up together. The premise simply doesn't make sense unless they do. Plus, Joey ending up with Pacey was the ultimate slap in the face.
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Old 06-30-2020, 02:18 PM
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I agree DJ should have ended up together, but as written there was no evidence of true love between Dj the final two seasons.

This is what I was thinking when I made up the thread title. They could have DJ fighting like cats and dogs, and the series would have worked, but no, they destroyed Dawson to a shell of his former self. Then to top it off they destroyed the wonderful romantic story KW wrote season two.

Which is why if I want to watch an episode of Dawson's Creek, I will only watch an episode from the first two seasons. When in the mood to watch an episode of Everwood, any episode of the four seasons will do

IMDB ratings...Dawson's Creek 6.6

Everwood......7.4
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Old 06-30-2020, 03:04 PM
  #146
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Dawson and Joey were systematically destroyed over the years by the cynical hacks in charge of the show. The final insult had to be Joey terming the time she slept with Dawson as her “only one-night stand,” which cheapened what should have been something beautiful between them into something they regretted, and it gave fresh fuel to all the Dawson haters by having Dawson deceive Joey by omission, and their one time “together” was forever tainted because of that. I do feel that Dawson was wrong to not tell Joey about Natasha before he slept with her, but on the same token, based on what we saw of Dawson and Natasha’s “relationship” in subsequent episodes, I’d hardly call her his “girlfriend,” because as we saw, neither one of them took the relationship very seriously, and they broke up as soon as the movie they were working on wrapped, so in many ways, Natasha really was, like Dawson said to Joey when he got caught, “a girl he had kind of been seeing.” Was he still wrong to not mention Natasha to Joey before they slept together? Absolutely, but I don’t feel that he was seriously involved with Natasha then, or afterwards. Sure, he apologized profusely to Natasha and he didn’t apologize to Joey, and I think he was dead wrong there, but can anyone objectively say that Dawson and Natasha were all that serious about one another? We saw Natasha tell that actor that Dawson wasn’t her boyfriend, and she then slept with said actor, so I’d hardly call what Dawson and Natasha had as a serious relationship. I also think that Dawson not apologizing to Joey was a deliberate ploy on the part of the writers to finish the destruction of everything that Dawson and Joey had once stood for, so there could be no going back for them.

To me, the whole scenario presented in The Song Remains The Same was the ultimate ploy to get sex between Dawson and Joey “over with,” and then destroy them forever, and quite frankly, I think that was incredibly insulting to the fans of this couple. If The Powers That Be didn’t want Dawson and Joey to be together romantically, why couldn’t they just let them be friends? Why kick their fans in the teeth over and over again? I think it was completely unnecessary to have Dawson and Joey sleep together just to have them have a bitter fight immediately thereafter and not speak to each other for months, and I’ll never understand why TMTB felt compelled to do that.
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Old 06-30-2020, 03:18 PM
  #147
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These writers were so lazy. I feel like when James asked for time off in season six the instant thought was they needed to throw a bone to Dawson and Joey fans yet split them up once again because James was not going to be around.

So they gave us the the sleeping together then used Dawson and Natasha as a way to cause a fight and separate them.

This was all to basically shove DJ away until the series finale.
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Old 06-30-2020, 03:23 PM
  #148
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I agree DJ should have ended up together, but as written there was no evidence of true love between Dj the final two seasons.
The writers attempted to do the same with PA but even earlier. The way Pacey treated Andie in The Longest Day was unthinkable. He acted like he was never in love with her. I was more hurt by how Pacey acted like Andie was almost a crush he was over more than anything at the end of season 3. At least Joey was conflicted. Pacey acted like Andie barely even existed. Then in season 5 when he takes care of Joey drunk or the K-Mart crap in season 6.

The writers tried to convince us Pacey was head over heels in love with Joey since season 3. Joey, it was different since she was constantly jealous, Coda, Swan Song, etc.

It was honestly worse imo for PA over DJ.

I just never bought any of it since PJ were unhealthy and never worked.
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Old 06-30-2020, 08:23 PM
  #149
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What gets me is at the end of season four they brought back Andie for Pacey and Dawson and Joey were making out in his room. Series over, past mistakes rectified. Also Promicide was meant to be the end of P/J forever and eternity.

Seasons 5 and 6 they make Dawson an ass again, But why? They knew they were going to end the series D/J or did they think Eddie was going to be her one true love?

I could say I wonder why Andie wasn't brought back for seasons five and six. She should have instead of Audrey. Andie and Pacey were back on track. Oh wait the IT girl factor. Meredith Monroe was quite busy at the time making movies. Maybe they asked and she said no. It's a possibility, but I doubt it.

So season six arrives and they found out it was really going to be the last season, By this time the series was a boring mess. So the writers know they have to end the series D/J.

As a matter of respect KW was asked to write the ending of the series..... As it turned out, big mistake.

KW wants Meredith Monroe back. There is only one reason he wants her back, DJ and PA

Could it be that Meredith,s failure to give him the 2 or 3 weeks he needed her for, contribute to his sudden change of mind? Or was it pressure from TPTB, in favour of the IT girl cause him to change his mind?

What a mess this series was at the end. So many actions made no sense.
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:21 AM
  #150
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What gets me is at the end of season four they brought back Andie for Pacey and Dawson and Joey were making out in his room. Series over, past mistakes rectified. Also Promicide was meant to be the end of P/J forever and eternity.
100%. They thought it was Coda then the series finale. The series should have ended. We would have had a DJ ending and either a PA one or showing them on track to reunite. No triangle would have existed in the series finale because Promicide and Dawson/Joey kissing in Coda sorted the triangle for good.

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Seasons 5 and 6 they make Dawson an ass again, But why? They knew they were going to end the series D/J or did they think Eddie was going to be her one true love?
Eddie was a combination of Dawson/Pacey. Not actively in the minds of the writers but that's sort of how he was. He was just a fleeting relationship for Joey and really only on the screen because the actor (who couldn't act) has a famous mother and sister. That is why he even lasted as long as he did.

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I could say I wonder why Andie wasn't brought back for seasons five and six. She should have instead of Audrey. Andie and Pacey were back on track. Oh wait the IT girl factor. Meredith Monroe was quite busy at the time making movies. Maybe they asked and she said no. It's a possibility, but I doubt it.
I wish it was Andie instead of Audrey in season 5. I didn't mind Audrey. I thought she was better than Joey but it should have been Andie. I wonder if they asked Meredith to return.

Quote:
So season six arrives and they found out it was really going to be the last season, By this time the series was a boring mess. So the writers know they have to end the series D/J.

As a matter of respect KW was asked to write the ending of the series..... As it turned out, big mistake.

KW wants Meredith Monroe back. There is only one reason he wants her back, DJ and PA

Could it be that Meredith,s failure to give him the 2 or 3 weeks he needed her for, contribute to his sudden change of mind? Or was it pressure from TPTB, in favour of the IT girl cause him to change his mind?

What a mess this series was at the end. So many actions made no sense.
I remember when it was announced Kevin Williamson was returning to write the series finale. Everyone, every single fanbase thought it meant for sure Dawson and Joey were getting the ending. What a joke it didn't happen. What an irony... if he wouldn't have returned it never would have been a ridiculous, insulting PJ ending.
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