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Old 05-20-2020, 03:45 PM
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Everwood Fans who are Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie Fans of Dawson's Creek #24: A broken promise. From greatness to mediocrity.



This is an appreciation thread for Everwood fans who are also Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie fans. For those who shipped these pairings, the series once had such great promise, but ended up being one of the most disappointing series to date. TPTB enjoyed manipulating the heart and soul of the old school (seasons 1/2) Dawson's Creek audience, who embraced the premise and the main pairings of the show; Dawson/Joey and Pacey/Andie fans. The first two seasons defined Dawson's Creek. Season 3 came along and the show simply wasn't the same anymore. New showrunner who essentially mocked the premise, destroyed the main pairings, and was basically just fine with dropping the quality in order to make the series his own. We know the drill. Discussing our main pairings, as well frustrations over storylines, writing, TPTB, fandom in general, is all welcome here.

Note: This is not a debate thread with other ships. This thread is strictly for Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie fans to appreciate the pairings and discuss aspects of the show, both good and bad. This thread was originally created to celebrate friendships between a couple of regulars on the Everwood board who, back in the day, posted on the Dawson's Creek board and encountered some terrible fan wars and not so great moments. We wanted a safe place to discuss our thoughts here on the Everwood board. That is how this thread was created. Jerry D, our amazing Administrator, and my very good friend, came up with the idea and the rest is history. For those of you who ship other pairings and don't agree with the content of this thread, of course there's the Dawson's Creek board and other threads scattered throughout Fan Forum perfectly designed for you.

Thanks!








Credit Xelphia Kenny:






Alternate S5 & S6 : He made a solemn promise he would come and visit her. Hell, he even jotted it down in indelible black ink onto the crisp pages of her brand new journal while wearing a big toothy grin on his face, but regardless, it had been months since Pacey had made any contact with Andie. Andie forced herself not to overthink it and chalked it up to life getting in the way, but the smallest embers inside of her heart that yearned for him still despite everything that happened between them started to prickle at the back of her head. Although once the orientation process at Harvard was over and the real work began, Andie’s thoughts of Pacey Witter were sidelined in order to make room for the mountains and mountains of schoolwork she was receiving on a daily basis.

That was until, out of the blue, Pacey literally came sailing back into her life looking tanned, well rested, and even more gorgeous. Andie vowed to never let herself fall back in love with Pacey, she made an ironclad pledge to herself to never stray back into that hornet’s nest, but his soft, warm gaze pointed in her direction had Andie convinced his heart was remembering the way it used to love her.

She was one hundred percent correct in her assumptions.

The laughter between them settled into a deep warmth and easiness, and they talked well into the wee hours of the night and gradually, the intimacy they once coveted as a couple so long ago had returned to their bodies in triplicate. It started with Pacey’s hand brushing up against hers when she handed him a magazine from a convenience store shelf, which then evolved into their hugs becoming longer and more needy each time they touched. Soon enough, Pacey did the unthinkable, and asked Andie a question she never thought she’d hear again in her life from him…

Pacey Witter had asked her out on a date.

At first, they had both agreed to not invest too much of themselves into the date, stating an urge to take things as slow as they could in order to protect themselves from any harmful fallout, but Pacey and Andie’s mutually intense bedroom eyes that screamed “make love to me.” seemed to tell another story altogether. The immense pain of potentially opening up old wounds over how their relationship crumbled in the past fell to the wayside as Pacey and Andie ended up having passionate, raw, soul searing sex in Andie’s shower. Every single iota of mistrust, devastating heartbreak, and bad memories in their past circled its way down the drain.

And as Andie sat by her vanity, drying her hair and watching Pacey getting ready for bed, she smiled to herself. At long last, she finally felt like she could breathe again.




Fic Links that TL22 supplied and commented on:


1.Kiss Me Chapter 1, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

This takes place at the end of season four. It's my very first P/A story. two short chapters. My version on how the graduation could/should have went.

2.Thanksgiving, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

A short interlude of what could have happened between seasons three and four.

3.Finding True Love Chapter 1, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

Fourteen chapters of what could have happened in the future. I wrote it over two years. The story starts season three when Pacey is getting ready to sail away. The end of chapter one has a unique twist, I think you'll enjoy.

The following is by ElizabethBella who wrote a fantastic Pacey/Andie story. (My favourite)

Come Sail Away Chapter 1: Separate, and apart, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
This is a multi chaptered story, you won't be able to put down.

The next is another one of my favourites written by the very talented StevieLuvsAlex

No amount of time, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

The next is a two part Pacey/Andie story written by me and StevieLuvsAlex. The first part is hers and the second part written by me won't make any sense if the first part is not read. Very very short

Everything happens for a reason, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
Written by StevieluvsAlex

Everything Happens For a Reason part Two, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction
Written by me and takes up where Everything Happens For a Reason leaves off

https://www.fanfiction.net/story/sto...toryid=7420836

This is a glimpse of Pacey, Andie, Joey and Dawson when they were very young. The story is two parts..

The next link is by the author Makesmyheadspin. IT is a bitter sweet story and really captures Pacey and Andie.

Fate is The Hunter, a dawson's creek fanfic | FanFiction

Fan Fic Written by Jerry:
Ghosts

Relapse

WHY I WILL NEVER BE A FAN OF PACEY / JOEY

The first two links will take you to a collection of D/J stories and the last link to a collection of P/A stories:

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...nd-Joey/27781/

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...-Always/33166/

https://www.fanfiction.net/community...Fanfics/45942//

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/2101505/1/Wandering-Heart

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Old 05-20-2020, 04:51 PM
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Thanks for the new thread Michelle.

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Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)
I can’t believe they ever thought the Eve storyline would be well received.
My understanding is the the new head writer (who James Van Der Beek, in an interview, said "hated the show") wanted to shake things up and take the show and the characters in an entirely different direction, and the results were a disaster.

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Major character destruction of both Dawson and Andie in order to facilitate the joke known as Pacey/Joey.
The character destruction of Andie was worse though, and it took place in the very first episode of Season Three, before they even thought about a Pacey and Joey paring, and the damage was so bad that poor Andie/Meredith was written off the show, which I consider to be a complete travesty.
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Old 05-20-2020, 07:21 PM
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Thanks for the new thread Michelle.

My understanding is the the new head writer (who James Van Der Beek, in an interview, said "hated the show") wanted to shake things up and take the show and the characters in an entirely different direction, and the results were a disaster.

The character destruction of Andie was worse though, and it took place in the very first episode of Season Three, before they even thought about a Pacey and Joey paring, and the damage was so bad that poor Andie/Meredith was written off the show, which I consider to be a complete travesty.
Interesting. Shame on Kevin for allowing this to take place. He didn’t have to permanently bail, he could have been a consultant and mostly been around planning each season.

It was worse, especially since they entirely made a mockery out of mental health.

I am actually one of the few people who found the character of Jack boring. While I liked the Jen and Jack friendship it was obvious this friendship was created to keep Jen’s attention away from dating anyone seriously who could show up the IT girl. They had Henry humiliate her in the end, CMMs character treat her like garbage but want to be a prince for Joey, and the guy in college (J. Ackles character) didn’t treat her perfectly either. Of course the second time with Dawson was only to make Joey jealous.

Having Jack around as a Jen distraction did nothing for me when Andie was tossed away. Maddening.

Dawson was out of character from 3.1 and on. That is why I was so mad about it. In no way do I buy Dawson rejecting Joey in the beginning of season 3 given his feelings for her. Instead he was focused on Eve. Then there was Dawson being humiliated by PJ and then attempting to make Dawson look like the villain and Pacey the knight. Honestly, Dawson would have been better off being written off the show so he wasn’t the out of character punching bag.
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Old 05-21-2020, 06:56 AM
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On the Greenie/Ephram/Amy thread, Leo and I are talking about how realistic and down to earth Everwood was. I just created a post about Dawson's Creek and how the kids talked like they were professional writers and how unrealistic they sounded. I discussed Ephram and Amy's ILY and how perfectly grounded and age appropriate it was.
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Old 05-21-2020, 08:00 AM
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Interesting. Shame on Kevin for allowing this to take place. He didn’t have to permanently bail, he could have been a consultant and mostly been around planning each season.
He obviously didn't care, and that trait has held true the the subsequent shows that he's been in charge of and abandoned.

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It was worse, especially since they entirely made a mockery out of mental health.
I completely agree.

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Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)
I am actually one of the few people who found the character of Jack boring. While I liked the Jen and Jack friendship it was obvious this friendship was created to keep Jen’s attention away from dating anyone seriously who could show up the IT girl. They had Henry humiliate her in the end, CMMs character treat her like garbage but want to be a prince for Joey, and the guy in college (J. Ackles character) didn’t treat her perfectly either. Of course the second time with Dawson was only to make Joey jealous.

Having Jack around as a Jen distraction did nothing for me when Andie was tossed away. Maddening.
I also found Jack boring and I agree that they put Jack and Jen together mainly because they were no longer Dawson and Joey's love interests and they needed to do something with them, but they discarded Andie entirely, which I think was so incredibly unfair.

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Dawson was out of character from 3.1 and on. That is why I was so mad about it. In no way do I buy Dawson rejecting Joey in the beginning of season 3 given his feelings for her. Instead he was focused on Eve. Then there was Dawson being humiliated by PJ and then attempting to make Dawson look like the villain and Pacey the knight. Honestly, Dawson would have been better off being written off the show so he wasn’t the out of character punching bag.
To be honest, I don't blame Dawson for not wanting to get back with Joey right away in Season Three, because she had broken his heart twice in the previous season, so I do think he needed some time to heal before he would want to be back with her, but him and Eve were horrible, and I don't think that he would have waited for as long as he did to try and get back with Joey.
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There are those who look at things the way they are and ask why - I dream of things that never were and ask why not. - Robert F. Kennedy
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Old 05-21-2020, 08:15 AM
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Yes, Joey put him through hell in season 2 so I don’t blame him either. I just hated how he went to Pacey and told him to watch her while he wanted to pursue something with Eve. It just seemed weird to me. Wanting to be single and figure things out, I buy. Dawson literally spent 6 episodes focused on Eve. I thought by the time Escape from Witch Island happened, and certainly by Four to Tango, he should have been ready to entertain the idea of possibly reuniting with Joey or at least taking it slowly.
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Old 05-21-2020, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
The character destruction of Andie was worse though, and it took place in the very first episode of Season Three, before they even thought about a Pacey and Joey paring, and the damage was so bad that poor Andie/Meredith was written off the show, which I consider to be a complete travesty.
I slightly disagree.In spite of the total ruination of Andie, the actress remained very popular. Magazine covers, commercials, interviews, etc.

Meredith Monroe was getting to popular. She was a superior actress to Katie Holmes, and once out of the ridiculous clothes and hair styles they made her wear she was and still is gorgeous. In an interview for some English magazine; Kerr was asked who did he prefer, meaning Joey or Jen. His reply was, "The girl who plays my sister, she is stunning."

In my opinion Meredith was let go because she was becoming to popular and was a threat to the IT girl.

There is quite a bit more to this story, and I have posted bits and pieces. If interested I will gladly sum it up and re-post.


Quote:
I am actually one of the few people who found the character of Jack boring. While I liked the Jen and Jack friendship it was obvious this friendship was created to keep Jen’s attention away from dating anyone seriously who could show up the IT girl. They had Henry humiliate her in the end, CMMs character treat her like garbage but want to be a prince for Joey, and the guy in college (J. Ackles character) didn’t treat her perfectly either. Of course the second time with Dawson was only to make Joey jealous.
To me the only time Jack was not boring was when he was Dawson's rival for Joey. When they made him gay and had him just be around to keep Jen occupied, I agree. Jack served no purpose.

Kerr Smith when informed he was going to become gay was furious. He was never told that he was eventually play a gay character. Maybe when KW signed Meredith and Kerr for season two he had no idea what he was eventually do that to the character Jack. As I have stated on here several times making Jack gay was the beginning of the end for the series.

Let's face it; from season three on the series became Joey's Creek. Hell in seasons five and six even Pacey served little or no purpose. In fact they could have dumped the character and have Joey dominate and screw with the head of some super rich, very smart quarterback of the football team. Of course Joey would be morally and intellectually superior.
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Old 05-22-2020, 05:09 AM
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To me the only time Jack was not boring was when he was Dawson's rival for Joey. When they made him gay and had him just be around to keep Jen occupied, I agree. Jack served no purpose.

Kerr Smith when informed he was going to become gay was furious. He was never told that he was eventually play a gay character. Maybe when KW signed Meredith and Kerr for season two he had no idea what he was eventually do that to the character Jack. As I have stated on here several times making Jack gay was the beginning of the end for the series.

Let's face it; from season three on the series became Joey's Creek. Hell in seasons five and six even Pacey served little or no purpose. In fact they could have dumped the character and have Joey dominate and screw with the head of some super rich, very smart quarterback of the football team. Of course Joey would be morally and intellectually superior.
It’s interesting what character Kerr Smith played on Riverdale.

Seems a lot of politics went on behind the scenes. Smith had a right to be pissed if Williamson didn’t tell him until later. Especially back then when playing gay characters was infrequent. Glad that has changed in the present but back then it wasn’t the norm so I could see why Smith was initially upset because he didn’t know.

I remember watching live and simply being ticked Jack was on my screen but not Andie. In my mind, they came as a package, they were siblings... Jack didn’t need a sister in Jen since he already had a sister named Andie! That’s how I felt. I just never loved that Andie left the screen while Jack remained. Jack was the ‘safe’ gay guy character who would distract Jen but Andie had to go because Pacey/Andie needed destroyed in order to prop Pacey/Joey. Plus, everyone knew having Meredith as Andie around for multiple reasons threatened Katie/Joey... threatened Katie as an actress, threatened the character in Joey since Andie had ten times the heart, threatened the pairing of Pacey/Joey since Pacey/Andie was Pacey’s best relationship.

This disgusted me while it played out live and I didn’t even truly understand just how bad the politics were back then like I do now.
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Old 05-22-2020, 04:52 PM
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It’s interesting what character Kerr Smith played on Riverdale.
What character did he play?

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Seems a lot of politics went on behind the scenes. Smith had a right to be pissed if Williamson didn’t tell him until later. Especially back then when playing gay characters was infrequent. Glad that has changed in the present but back then it wasn’t the norm so I could see why Smith was initially upset because he didn’t know.

I remember watching live and simply being ticked Jack was on my screen but not Andie. In my mind, they came as a package, they were siblings... Jack didn’t need a sister in Jen since he already had a sister named Andie! That’s how I felt. I just never loved that Andie left the screen while Jack remained. Jack was the ‘safe’ gay guy character who would distract Jen but Andie had to go because Pacey/Andie needed destroyed in order to prop Pacey/Joey. Plus, everyone knew having Meredith as Andie around for multiple reasons threatened Katie/Joey... threatened Katie as an actress, threatened the character in Joey since Andie had ten times the heart, threatened the pairing of Pacey/Joey since Pacey/Andie was Pacey’s best relationship.

This disgusted me while it played out live and I didn’t even truly understand just how bad the politics were back then like I do now.
I think that you're both correct that Andie was destroyed so she couldn't outshine Joey. I hated Season Two because of what they did to Dawson and Joey as soon as they put them together, but I loved Pacey and Andie in that season, and I hated what was done to her.
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The energy, the faith, the devotion which we bring to this endeavor will light our country and all who serve it - and the glow from that fire can truly light the world. - John F. Kennedy

There are those who look at things the way they are and ask why - I dream of things that never were and ask why not. - Robert F. Kennedy
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Old 05-22-2020, 05:33 PM
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What character did he play?
Mr. Honey. The high school principal. He is a dick.
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Old 05-22-2020, 05:36 PM
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What character did he play?
He was a super conservative principal who was strict to a fault. But then there was a twist and all his stern behavior was supposedly truly looking out for his students. I didn’t buy it because he did shady things for discipline but that is what they want us to believe.

Quote:
I think that you're both correct that Andie was destroyed so she couldn't outshine Joey. I hated Season Two because of what they did to Dawson and Joey as soon as they put them together, but I loved Pacey and Andie in that season, and I hated what was done to her.
I still cannot believe they destroyed everything they built between Pacey and Andie in season 2. Like I mentioned up thread, they should have left Pacey/Andie alone as the stable pairing. But of course they had plans to destroy the series instead.
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Old 05-22-2020, 06:14 PM
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What's ironic is that Paul Stupin originally came to Kevin Williamson to create Dawson's Creek, but once Williamson left Stupin seemed hell-bent on destroying everything that Williamson had created.
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The energy, the faith, the devotion which we bring to this endeavor will light our country and all who serve it - and the glow from that fire can truly light the world. - John F. Kennedy

There are those who look at things the way they are and ask why - I dream of things that never were and ask why not. - Robert F. Kennedy
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Old 05-22-2020, 07:51 PM
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He was an egotistical hack who wanted to create something he could call his own. He took a big chance, flopped, and basically ruined any chance he had at a successful career.
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Old 05-23-2020, 06:42 AM
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He was an egotistical hack who wanted to create something he could call his own. He took a big chance, flopped, and basically ruined any chance he had at a successful career.
That's a perfect way of describing Paul Stupin.
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The energy, the faith, the devotion which we bring to this endeavor will light our country and all who serve it - and the glow from that fire can truly light the world. - John F. Kennedy

There are those who look at things the way they are and ask why - I dream of things that never were and ask why not. - Robert F. Kennedy
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Old 05-23-2020, 07:31 AM
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That's a perfect way of describing Paul Stupin.


Berlanti might have come up with the initial ridiculous idea of PJ, but he never wanted it to last or play out like it did. He wouldn't have been saying he was a DJ fan at the end of the series (and that they should have ended up together).

So it's like Berlanti came up with a short-term teen soap idea with the intention of it lasting probably a couple episodes, but Stupid took the idea and made it his own. He was the mad scientist that grabbed on for dear life and tried to form it into something beautiful and lasting. Failed experiment. Such a destruction it's impossible to revive or reboot the series.

Seriously, even putting aside the obvious reason why they cannot revive... Jen's death... they also cannot revive because the series ended in a way that destroyed the entire premise of the original series. How can you revive destruction and failure?
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