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Old 10-04-2017, 10:47 PM
  #46
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I hate that so much. Brooke was never held responsible for anything. Most friendships would break given what Brooke did to Peyton in season 1 but later on when Brooke went into Satan-mode, laughing in Peyton's face about her mother dying? Peyton should have punched Brooke in the face, not once, not twice, but three times and then dumped her a$$ for good. Peyton never should have spoken to Brooke again. Brooke didn't deserve being Peyton's friend. Peyton should have dumped her and never looked back.
I don't really know what more to say. I just can't stand the way she treated everyone. Like everyone owed her something. So her parents left, at least her parents could come back! Peyton's first mom, Anna, killed while trying to pick her up from school. Ellie died from cancer. So I guess those are Peyton's fault too. The guy who ran the red light, killing Anna was speeding because Peyton was involved?!? Far fetched I know, but that's how ridiculous it got when Brooke played the victim. Everything was strewn into her direction, like a fastball coming down the plate. It was so stupid!

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Haley/Brooke friendship made me sick. Brooke treated Haley like a loser during the early part of the series and Haley couldn't stand Brooke. Haley spoke for us or the fans who had a clue. Then the only reason they shared a space together was because Brooke, as usual, had to use someone for her benefit. They didn't have a real friendship. It was convenience.
They barely knew each other before Season 3. The ONLY reason why they even interacted was because of Nathan, really. Haley needed a place to stay because Nathan was living at home and was considering a divorce. Haley stayed there because she had no where else to go. Haley only joined the cheer squad to get to spend time with Nahtan during basketball practice. So it was never about Brooke at all, it was about Haley!

When Nathan/Haley moved back into the apartment, Brooke gave her key back and said they made everyone else believe in true love. Something like that. Brooke knew Lucas wasn't her true love and that statement proved it. She was beating the dead horse and knew it, but yet, she did it anyway

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Haley and Peyton bonded from day 1. In the episode when they are stranded, they couldn't stop talking, they just naturally fit together and that's the way it always was between them.
Every Night Is Another Story! That's the episode where they had to get gas because some people don't know how to fill up the gas tank, figures, she's trying to fill her own gas tank instead. They talked about music, feelings. Haley knew that Peyton had feelings for Lucas, Peyton didn't have to say anything. It was purely evident in that scene. Then dumbass Brooke had to say "you know you won't be friends tomorrow." She just HAD to ruin it. Why not medicate her more often and stick her in the back seat, she takes all the boys there anyway.

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Yet what happened? We were force-fed Haley/Brooke way more than Haley/Peyton since Saint Brooke could do no wrong and deserved everything while never accepting responsibility for being a very ugly person in those early but very important years. Drives me crazy.
What makes it much worse, as yet if it can get worse...when Brooke got married, Haley was her matron of honor and acted like they had been best friends since childhood and like Peyton never mattered. I hated that episode. It completely rewrote everything Peyton was. So the actress couldn't come back, so what, why be written in a way that loses so much story, it's practically insulting.

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You do, you do, you do, you do, you do, you do, you do. Please do.
Yes, please Jerry! I'd love to read your thoughts after watching the earlier seasons!

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1. Lucas telling Peyton he hated her pissed me off so much.
I hated Lucas so much after that! It segwayed into a really great scene, so it kinda softens it a little bit. But honestly, what did Lucas expect was going to happen when he Peyton again? That they were just going to be amicable exes and go on with that. Haley said it best, "Peyton is not just another ex-girlfriend and everyone knows that", except for Lucas. Yeah, of course he was going to get all those feelings back when he saw her again. He proposed to her, he wanted to marry her, have children with her and she said no. How could that not have a reverse action to it? Lucas didn't want to get hurt again, I get it, but when did it happen that he wanted to rip out his best friend from his life. Haley's a great friend, but Peyton is his soulmate. She's the one who's going to be there in the highest highs and lowest lows. He would never have that with Lindsay, he would never have that with Brooke or anyone else he'd encounter. He never, in a moment, doubted that he wouldn't have that with Peyton. She was his angel, according to his letters he wrote in junior year and when he finally got the courage to talk to Peyton. That's who Lucas Scott was and is, the man who loves Peyton Sawyer. The one who told Peyton he hated her, that wasn't Lucas or even drunk Lucas. That was a broken man out to break the one thing that broke him and make them feel as badly as he did in that moment.
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4. The tour thing sucked due to lack of communication. I would have been fine with Haley going on tour (she deserved to, just like Nathan went away for pro basketball) but the communication was bad and kissing Chris was unacceptable too.
To defend the show a little bit, Joy went on the tour and wasn't available for filming, that's how I justify a little bit of Season 2 (a liiiiiittle bit lol). But yes, the entire Chris Keller storyline in Season 2 was really awful. Haley was devoted to Nathan, always will be. It was just written that Haley would see Chris Keller as anything but a fellow musician. I think she was confused and of course Chris being Chris capitalized on that because he really did like her and didn't really care about her relationship with Nathan.
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5. Nathan and Nanny Carrie. Terrible.
I don't even see what the point of this storyline was. For Haley to feel undesirable to her husband beause she wasn't trotting around in a two piece while supossedly babysitting a 5 year old boy? I mean come on, it was so stupid. Haley should have thrown her out when she noticed Carrie checking out Nathan or him acting weird. And Nathan checking out another woman that is not his wife? He's loved Haley since they were 17 years old and then a woman he barely knows is catching his attention?! How could you want anyone besides Haley? She's perfect. Her story for destroying Nathan's life was that she went to the rival high school that Tree Hill beat to win the championship. Lame!? I mean come on, it's insulting.
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:31 AM
  #47
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Do you mean in the sense that it was a bad time for the character or that you hated this storyline and wished it didn't happen?
Both, since most of the time it's the same thing lol.
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:45 AM
  #48
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1. Lucas telling Peyton he hated her pissed me off so much.

That really annoyed me tbh and was out of character for S1-4 Luke imo.
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2. Lucas, a little crying boy running from Peyton in seasons 1/2/3 and then later well after high school doing the same thing with Mister Ed/Lindsey was even more annoying because he was many years older and still went there... and again, see 1, the hating her line was horrible. I know he said I hated her since it was easier than saying he loved her... the episode title said as much... still he was a grown up and should have just been mature instead of immature.
Yeah, Luke's running from his feelings from Peyton was pretty annoying, especially in season 1 and 5. To be fair though, the fact that was Peyton was playing house with Jake two seconds after LP 'broke up' in S1 pretty annoying too.

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6. Peyton dealing with disgusting Brooke in the early seasons, having a stupid father who thought it was okay leaving her alone, her mother died, another mother died, psycho Derek. Peyton arguably had it the worst yet had a heart of gold. I sound like a broken record but this is why it bothers me that Jerry thought she sucked in season 5! He has to see 1-4 to know that's not true AND get filled it on Saint Brooke in season 5 (who was better sure) because it's difficult totally forgetting about what she pulled in seasons 1-3, little of 4 too.
I've said this before, but Breyton would have taken an break from each other in S1/2. Also would have preferred for Ellie to stay around for a lot longer and the Psycho Derek situation not to happen.
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:35 AM
  #49
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Exactly!

I just find it impossible to explain away Brooke seasons 1-4, parts of 4 but especially seasons 1-3. How do you explain her behavior as anything but disgusting given what she did to Peyton and at times, even Lucas? She manipulated everything! She cried victim after torturing Peyton and even Lucas. She was just horrible. You cannot explain away her behavior! All the Brooke stans have on Peyton is the two kisses... BUT without admitting Brooke instigated the entire situation. Funny how that works. The entire story isn't told. But they cannot punch at Peyton's heart yet think Brooke was just fine and an ultimate victim in the early seasons. Right on.
Yeah, the way that some people worship is just ridiculous in my eyes.
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:35 AM
  #50
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I definitely need to watch the early seasons, and then I'll post my thoughts!
Definitely will be interesting to hear them
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Old 10-05-2017, 11:04 AM
  #51
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Yeah, the way that some people worship is just ridiculous in my eyes.
and the way it was also so subjective is what got me
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Old 10-05-2017, 12:42 PM
  #52
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Yeah, Luke's running from his feelings from Peyton was pretty annoying, especially in season 1 and 5. To be fair though, the fact that was Peyton was playing house with Jake two seconds after LP 'broke up' in S1 pretty annoying too.
It definitely was. The difference for me is Peyton learned from high school mistakes and didn't make them again as an adult. Lucas just simply didn't learn yet as a grown adult.

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I've said this before, but Breyton would have taken an break from each other in S1/2. Also would have preferred for Ellie to stay around for a lot longer and the Psycho Derek situation not to happen.
In real life the Breyton friendship would have been severed or in need of severe rebuilding.
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Old 10-05-2017, 12:44 PM
  #53
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Yeah, the way that some people worship is just ridiculous in my eyes.
Worship without sound debating. I wanted to know why they thought Brooke's actions were okay but I just never got a proper explanation. All I got was Lucas and Peyton harmed Brooke while ignoring Brooke and her horrible faults.
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:20 PM
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I don't really know what more to say. I just can't stand the way she treated everyone. Like everyone owed her something. So her parents left, at least her parents could come back! Peyton's first mom, Anna, killed while trying to pick her up from school. Ellie died from cancer. So I guess those are Peyton's fault too. The guy who ran the red light, killing Anna was speeding because Peyton was involved?!? Far fetched I know, but that's how ridiculous it got when Brooke played the victim. Everything was strewn into her direction, like a fastball coming down the plate. It was so stupid!
It was! Brooke got much better as the series rolled along, especially after the time jump, but the character of Brooke was so horrible in those earlier seasons I found it really hard to forget everything.

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They barely knew each other before Season 3. The ONLY reason why they even interacted was because of Nathan, really. Haley needed a place to stay because Nathan was living at home and was considering a divorce. Haley stayed there because she had no where else to go. Haley only joined the cheer squad to get to spend time with Nahtan during basketball practice. So it was never about Brooke at all, it was about Haley!

When Nathan/Haley moved back into the apartment, Brooke gave her key back and said they made everyone else believe in true love. Something like that. Brooke knew Lucas wasn't her true love and that statement proved it. She was beating the dead horse and knew it, but yet, she did it anyway
Very true about Haley. I don't understand why the Haley/Brooke friendship was shoved in our face in the later seasons. They didn't build any sort of friendship before this time. It was a joke.

Brooke always looked out for Brooke. That was her deal. She never put anyone in front of herself.

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Every Night Is Another Story! That's the episode where they had to get gas because some people don't know how to fill up the gas tank, figures, she's trying to fill her own gas tank instead. They talked about music, feelings. Haley knew that Peyton had feelings for Lucas, Peyton didn't have to say anything. It was purely evident in that scene. Then dumbass Brooke had to say "you know you won't be friends tomorrow." She just HAD to ruin it.
Brooke was disgusting in this episode.

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Why not medicate her more often and stick her in the back seat, she takes all the boys there anyway.


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What makes it much worse, as yet if it can get worse...when Brooke got married, Haley was her matron of honor and acted like they had been best friends since childhood and like Peyton never mattered. I hated that episode. It completely rewrote everything Peyton was. So the actress couldn't come back, so what, why be written in a way that loses so much story, it's practically insulting.
I hated that so much too and Mark made sure it was set up that way. He had something against Hilarie during this time period and he took it out on the character of Peyton as a result.

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I hated Lucas so much after that! It segwayed into a really great scene, so it kinda softens it a little bit. But honestly, what did Lucas expect was going to happen when he Peyton again? That they were just going to be amicable exes and go on with that. Haley said it best, "Peyton is not just another ex-girlfriend and everyone knows that", except for Lucas. Yeah, of course he was going to get all those feelings back when he saw her again. He proposed to her, he wanted to marry her, have children with her and she said no. How could that not have a reverse action to it? Lucas didn't want to get hurt again, I get it, but when did it happen that he wanted to rip out his best friend from his life. Haley's a great friend, but Peyton is his soulmate. She's the one who's going to be there in the highest highs and lowest lows. He would never have that with Lindsay, he would never have that with Brooke or anyone else he'd encounter. He never, in a moment, doubted that he wouldn't have that with Peyton. She was his angel, according to his letters he wrote in junior year and when he finally got the courage to talk to Peyton. That's who Lucas Scott was and is, the man who loves Peyton Sawyer. The one who told Peyton he hated her, that wasn't Lucas or even drunk Lucas. That was a broken man out to break the one thing that broke him and make them feel as badly as he did in that moment.


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To defend the show a little bit, Joy went on the tour and wasn't available for filming, that's how I justify a little bit of Season 2 (a liiiiiittle bit lol). But yes, the entire Chris Keller storyline in Season 2 was really awful. Haley was devoted to Nathan, always will be. It was just written that Haley would see Chris Keller as anything but a fellow musician. I think she was confused and of course Chris being Chris capitalized on that because he really did like her and didn't really care about her relationship with Nathan.
Yes, the real life thing with Joy obviously caused the tour thing on the show. I would have been perfectly fine with the entire storyline if they didn't have Chris drooling over Haley every two seconds. It would have been an intriguing storyline showing Naley dealing with long distance.

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I don't even see what the point of this storyline was. For Haley to feel undesirable to her husband beause she wasn't trotting around in a two piece while supossedly babysitting a 5 year old boy? I mean come on, it was so stupid. Haley should have thrown her out when she noticed Carrie checking out Nathan or him acting weird. And Nathan checking out another woman that is not his wife? He's loved Haley since they were 17 years old and then a woman he barely knows is catching his attention?! How could you want anyone besides Haley? She's perfect. Her story for destroying Nathan's life was that she went to the rival high school that Tree Hill beat to win the championship. Lame!? I mean come on, it's insulting.
So true!
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Old 10-09-2017, 01:11 AM
  #55
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Worship without sound debating. I wanted to know why they thought Brooke's actions were okay but I just never got a proper explanation. All I got was Lucas and Peyton harmed Brooke while ignoring Brooke and her horrible faults.
Yep and some of them even made LP's behaviour worse at times to make Brooke look better too.
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Old 10-09-2017, 01:13 AM
  #56
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It definitely was. The difference for me is Peyton learned from high school mistakes and didn't make them again as an adult. Lucas just simply didn't learn yet as a grown adult.
Besides kissing him of course lol. As an Lucas fan, S5 was an hard season to watch for the regression of his character.

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In real life the Breyton friendship would have been severed or in need of severe rebuilding.
Yeah definitely.
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Old 10-09-2017, 06:42 AM
  #57
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Yep and some of them even made LP's behaviour worse at times to make Brooke look better too.
Exactly. I don't know how they could go there given Brooke's despicable behavior. I guess they see what they want to see. But when Sophia, herself, had issues with Brooke, along with shipping Lucas/Peyton you know it's clear what sort of reaction the fans were meant to have.
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Old 10-09-2017, 06:53 AM
  #58
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Besides kissing him of course lol. As an Lucas fan, S5 was an hard season to watch for the regression of his character.
Yes, lol. I just meant in early season 1, Peyton kept pushing Lucas away because she was scared and messed up over her family life situation. When the time jump happened and she returned to Tree Hill, she wasn't running from Lucas. She wanted to work things out with him even though he left her in LA. She still never ran away when she returned to Tree Hill. She also never used a present relationship at the time to run as well. She came back home single and open to communicating with Lucas. It was Lucas who was with someone he didn't love close to the way he loved Peyton. He tried to hide with Lindsey just like he hid with Brooke. No evolution whatsoever. You are right, it was really tough seeing Lucas in season 5 make the same mistakes again.
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Old 10-10-2017, 02:18 AM
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Exactly. I don't know how they could go there given Brooke's despicable behavior. I guess they see what they want to see. But when Sophia, herself, had issues with Brooke, along with shipping Lucas/Peyton you know it's clear what sort of reaction the fans were meant to have.
Yeah definitely haha.
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Old 10-10-2017, 02:20 AM
  #60
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Yes, lol. I just meant in early season 1, Peyton kept pushing Lucas away because she was scared and messed up over her family life situation. When the time jump happened and she returned to Tree Hill, she wasn't running from Lucas. She wanted to work things out with him even though he left her in LA. She still never ran away when she returned to Tree Hill. She also never used a present relationship at the time to run as well. She came back home single and open to communicating with Lucas. It was Lucas who was with someone he didn't love close to the way he loved Peyton. He tried to hide with Lindsey just like he hid with Brooke. No evolution whatsoever. You are right, it was really tough seeing Lucas in season 5 make the same mistakes again.
Yeah that's definitely true haha and honestly I will always think S5 Luke was OOC for most of the season.
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