'Tos

Hee, well, I've sort of amassed a semi-long list of books that I plan to read, so you can recommend it, I just don't know when I'll get to it!

Hard Times isn't so lengthy. I wonder why that is. I've only had the luxury of reading his stuff in classes, so I'm enjoying an individual reading.

Hee! Traitor.

How about you, Betty? Any plans for the 4th?

And yay for the new computer, and the "2" button! How did that come off??

It's all nutty, isn't it? I haven't watched any of the coverage since the first day. It's all depressing and weird, and it doesn't look to be ending anytime soon. Custody cases, his will, debt, investigations. This story is going to be the top story for at least the next few weeks.

Thief Of Love

Well, then: Dickens' Fur Coat and Charlotte's Unanswered Letters: The Rows and Romances of England's Great Victorian Novelists, by Daniel Pool. And don't be put off by the "romances" part of the title, because it's pretty much just there for alliterative purposes. "Rumor" would actually have worked better, because, man alive, could Victorians gossip. The modern world's got nothing on them, hee. But it's really just the kind of book that makes me want to write, and read lots of nineteenth-century literature, and work in publishing. The author is fantastic, too; he has a very wry kind of voice, which is what always provides for an excellent non-fiction read.

You mentioned Faulkner (great teen novelist that he was, hee) in the last thread -- what have you read of his? And did you like it, at all? Because I have spent the last year checking out The Sound and the Fury from the library over and over again, having always heard things about Faulkner's narrative approach that intrigued me, and having been assured by my ex-advisor that I'd love him, and...I absolutely cannot get past the first few pages, with Benjy's narrative. "They took the flag out, and they were hitting. Then they put the flag back and they went to the table, and he hit and the other hit. Then they went on, and I went along the fence." It makes me want to put my head through a wall. I know Faulkner's using the narrative voice to illustrate each character's intellect and personality, and I love that concept in theory, but I don't think I can bear multiple chapters of this before he finally gets to the characters who have slightly more intricate thought processes.

I really wish I knew, but all I remember is typing one day and the "2" just coming off in my hands as I did so, hee. Surely something happened to trigger that, but darned if I know what it was.

Bloody entertainment-obsessed media. Yesterday I heard of one poll that indicated that TV news (I'm pretty sure it was only television that was considered here) devoted 93% of its coverage in a specific period, probably the day of and after his death, to the Jackson story. It's sad that he's dead, the fact of it was newsworthy, inasmuch as it's appropriate to report "Hey, very famous artist and somewhat notorious/controversial figure just died unexpectedly at a fairly young age" and to spend a few minutes commemorating his life, but...this is obscene. Especially with the many major things happening in the world and, as far as American coverage is concerned, the U.S., at the moment. Let the man rest in peace, let his family (famewhore abusive father aside) grieve, let the legal matters be settled privately. Not that any of this will happen, mind you.

jediwands

From a psychological standpoint (since I always go there) I am so worried about Jackson's children. First of all, one of them watched him literally drop dead. All are mourning but imagine if they remotely read a newspaper or watched TV? To hear the stuff about Jackson's past, the allegations that he was addicted to many different kinds of medications, their Grandfather being physically abusive allegedly, Jackson might not even being their real father, and the list goes on! All I know is I hope someone is protecting them. I am worried about them psychologically and in a massive way.

SPORTSUSA

Completely agree. The children are the true victims of all of this. I wish the media would please be a little sensitive. I know media and sensitive typically do not go together but it really is pathetic how these children are possibly subjected to this.

everwoodfan52

Oh, I definitely agree. Those poor kids. I didn't realize that they saw Michael die. What about their mom? She's seems to be completely out of the picture. It appears that she relinquished all rights a long time ago.
I frankly don't believe that Michael is their real father. From what I've read...there was a sperm doner. I don't think that Michael was into any of that....or maybe wasn't capable of any of that?
Seriously though, I think that Michael would be appalled if he saw what was going on now. Let him rest in peace and let it all be private.


No, I'm staying home. I have an opportunity to go down to the beach....but it's such a zoo during holidays and the traffic is usually horrendous.
I would have to return on Sunday, anyway, so it's not worth it. On Sunday, I'm attending a Bris. A Jewish friend of mine is having her new son circumcised and it's a big production followed by a party. This should be interesting....it's my first. I'm not sure that I want to witness the actual event....poor baby!

'Tos

Wow, I didn't know that one of the kids saw him die too. That's terrible. Seriously, these kids were in a lifetime of therapy even before he died with all the crap that they've been through with him and having to wear masks all that just to leave their houses. Now, they're going to be in even more need for it.

Apparently she is fighting for custody. I don't really know what to think about that.. Part of me wants them away from that circus show that is the Jackson family and just living a normal life with their biological mother. Which probably isn't possible with sites like TMZ around. The other part of me knows that they don't know her at all, and she would be ripping them away from the life that they've always lived. What do you think about the custody issue, Michelle? What's best for the kids?

Following Jackson talk to talk of a bris is so surreal, hee.

Hee, I can guarantee that if he was aware of it, he would rather not have a bunch of people watch this event, for sure.

jediwands

They are.

Absolutely. Yes, his one son watched Michael drop to the ground plain as day. So heartbreaking. Thankfully, children can bounce back from severe stress and anxiety way more than adults can. It seems impossible to fathom but it's true. This is a horrible topic but childhood rape? A child can get over that better than an adult woman being raped for example. It's due to the mental process and how a childs mind can almost regenerate. I could write pages and pages on it but yes, there certainly is that going on. The son who saw him die will get over the shock, indeed. The other stuff, though, if it lingers and continues is what is not good.

I think the real mom (if she is the real mom, should we even trust this unless there's proof since there's a woman from the UK who claims she is the mother of all his children and she has proof of this? LOL) was paid quite nicely to have a very passive role in all of this for years and years. But you're right, Tos, supposedly she is fighting for custody now, too. Funny how these things happen whenever the person who passed away, I don't know, is worth, MILLIONS?

First, I think they all need DNA testing to figure out exactly what is going on as far as who is the real mother. LOL. Secondly, you know it's a touchy subject with so many factors involved. Michael's wish was for his mother to raise his children. That has to be taken into account and on the surface it is realistic to believe that is what his children would also want. I can't imagine them wanting to leave their Grandmother, the mother of the only father they knew. I can't see it. But then there's the Grandfather in there who seems like a moron and then you are wondering even if the physical abuse took place 40 years ago, what impact if any, he could have on the children? Is he still abusive? Could he abuse them too? If Debra whatever is the real mother, yes she certainly has rights, but you have to question why she would all of a sudden want them if she never did before. Well, money is the reason, LOL, but you also have to wonder if she truly wants them now or if it's not, again, about the money.

What I would do? Get a really good shrink involved, a good social worker, and ask THE CHILDREN what their wishes are. That's what I think it boils down to. Finding out ultimately what they want, weighing all of the facts after you find this out, then coming to a decision. I think it starts with the children. Sure you cannot JUST go by the children because that is why they are children, they are not necessarily equipped to completely convey what is best, but you still want to hear them, feel out what they are generally saying because children are the most brutally honest people on the planet. They tell it like it is and if you have a good psychologist/psychiatrist talking with them, they will pick up on so much and have a perfect understanding of what is best for them.

I laughed so hard while reading this.

Abomasum

Hey! Just dropping by... still not done with school... still have some last impressions to make. So I'm working... all the time... I only slept for five of the last 84? hours. And I have no idea why I'm still bouncy... didn't even drink coffee.
I love the summer, by the way. We had 32°C today and like 15 hours of sunshine? Hee!

'Tos

Leo! You tell that school to stop working you so hard, or else Betty and I will ban them. I'm sure our mod powers work across borders.

Seriously, don't over-work yourself and get exhausted!

But I'm glad that the summer's great over there! And I can't wait until you're out to be able to enjoy it more!

Eek, I have so much to reply to, hee. Probably won't get to all of it today, unfortunately.

I'll say this about the Jackson coverage: at least with Palin resigning as govnah, the media circus will shift away from him a bit. Because man, they are going to go crazy on her.

That's a good point, that kids can get over the shock, but the memory if what happened will still linger, sadly. Hopefully not enough to deeply affect him. But you're right, kids can be surprisingly resilient.

Ooh, I like that! They should definitely have a say. Without any involvement or persuasion from either side, just being allowed to think of it over by themselves and come up with a collective decision. Because if the biological mom is the bio mom, didn't she give birth to only two of the kids? What happens to the third one. Blanket, I think is his name. Hee, what is with celebrity baby names?! Oh, that's a whole different topic. Anyway, in a perfect world, they will have a say that they come to with each other and without either side trying to tell them what to do. No matter what happens to them, it probably won't be perfect, but if they have a say, they'll at least be comfortable with what happens.

jediwands

Indeed. It seems very weird but it's true... the one son who saw Michael die which is the major shock can get over this but the other stuff... such as learning this horrible information about their father, if he even is their real father, or who their mother is, their Grandfather being abusive, Michael's substance abuse problems, these kind of things, if they are exposed to them and have this knowledge, it can have a negative influence on them now and in the future. If they have a good support network, they will be protected, though. I really hope they have this.

Exactly and that's key. If they are not coached and I think a good mental health specialist will be able to tell this straight up. If you get to the bottom of what their true wants and desires are that is very important here and it can be done.

LOL. Yep. That makes it very complicated and that could be awfully important in that the courts hate splitting up children. They do not like to do this if they can help it and I believe that could be the case in this situation. Especially with the bio mom not being involved before this.

Exactly. So many times it's the adults bickering it out going round and round whenever one of the easiest ways of solving an issue is simply trusting the children, hearing their voices, because their voices mean something, sometimes they mean everything.

'Tos

Happy July 4th, you wacky Americans!

Thief Of Love

I'm finding it increasingly suspicious that you and Betty always seem to come on the board at the same time, hee. I have no idea what that means, but it's eerie.

And I know I was griping about Faulkner and all, but can you make any sort of recommendation on that front? Because I'd like to like him. Mainly because this one professor that I hated couldn't stand him, and I don't want to have anything in common with her.

'Tos

Betty and I have been eerily synchronized since we became mods, heh.

Hee, yeah, I was planning to get back to that today. The book that I got out from the library was, As I Lay Dying, which I read...like, a decade ago so I'm not really sure what it's like, heh. That's why I picked it up. I do remember liking it back then, but, I think I'll wait until I re-read it to give a recommendation. I think it has a more interesting premise than The Sound and the Fury, at the very least.

Ooh! Sounds interesting! I've added it to the list. Now, when I actually get to it is another matter entirely, hee, but it's on!

You must have been using the "2" key a lot for some odd reason, heh.

Thief Of Love

Oh! As I Lay Dying is the other Faulkner book I got from the library the other day! Great, I'll give that one a go then.

I blame the decade and my class numbers. Writing all those papers freshman and sophomore years dated "Month Day, 200_" for "English or History 2__." Heh.

'Tos

And you thought Betty and I were eerie! Hee!

I'm not sure if you'll like it any better as I'm sure he writes in the exact same style, though. Maybe there are better characters at the beginning, at least, to get you past the first few pages? We can all hope.

Heh, that actually might explain it. You can bring it up with your old school and get reimbursed for a new "2" key, heh.