[cowgirl08]

Originally Posted by Betty Does anyone else feel that Lucas is a little too quick to declare his love for a woman? It seems to come out of his mouth a little too easily. Does anyone (even if you are not a Leyton fan) feel any chemistry when Lucas and Lindsey are together?

The L word does seem to flow freely for him. But with Lindsay I guess they have been together for two years at this point so that would be expected. And no on the chemistry I didn't see it myself but I tend not to see it in couples I didn't get to see their full story on. When the first time I meet a couple is two years into their relationship? Yawn, moving on.

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) Great thoughts. I absolutely love Brooke in season 5. I just love her. Great point about Lucas and Peyton being at different places too concerning career and such. I have yet to read a comment saying Peyton should have said yes and was wrong not to. It made serious sense for her to not be able to answer. I wasn't threatened by Lindsey... I just don't want her on my screen. It's just such a downer given what we saw in season 4 and then now we're back to this crap with the obstacles for Lucas/Peyton. It's tiring. Yes, I was never threatened by Lindsey, I just didn't like to deal with this storyline. It's just wasted space. Everyone knows Lucas/Peyton are ending up together so find a more clever way of going there besides Lucas acting like CMM himself LOL and proposing to someone he has no business proposing to. I just wish Mark would have found more Naley-like ways to insert drama for Lucas/Peyton instead of using Lindsey. That's why I can't take her seriously which means I can't feel for her in the library, either. She's like a robotic wedge but an annoying wedge at that because I feel like another route could have taken place to keep things interesting and still push the Lucas/Peyton story.

Yeah it's nice seeing Brooke finally grown up, she changed a lot in those four years.

Agreed. I get that it was tough for Lucas to hear a "not right now" after building it up in his head all the way there but come on man! She didn't say she doesn't love you, in fact her response showed more confidence in their relationship than his did.

That's the thing. I guess the writers felt they did give LP a wedge that wasn't another character, it was the fact the proposal didn't go as planed and they were across country from each other. Had the season picked up right off that would have been the wedge but since it skipped ahead 4 years, I assume they felt it unrealistic for them both to still be single and not together so Lindsay was the answer. Again to me it never bothered me because it was clear she wasn't sticking around, she was just a vehicle for telling the Lucas Peyton story. Which is ironic, since Lindsay was in fact the person to share their story with the world through his book....oh how the web weaves....

[jediwands]

Will respond fully when I get home. Driving right now... Or at a stoplight... lol

I thought of Lucas/Peyton for a second and bam, this song came on:



That's like the season 1 Lucas/Peyton theme song. It was unreal how that came on. Especially since you are seeing flashes of season 1 in early season 5 with the "your art matters" stuff.

I'm going to have to watch this season 1 episide today.

Back shortly to respond more!

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by Betty OMG....most definitely!

Yes, Sophia just glows. In the first four seasons I didn't Sophia's looks as much because I was too busy annoyed by stuff Brooke did. This season, you just sense the change in Brooke and funny how you notice all the more just what a drop dead gorgeous woman the actress is.

Originally Posted by Betty Not necessary at all! And Haley was actually puzzled why Peyton walked away!

I really, really don't understand it. The fact that in later episodes she gets ticked at Peyton for being upset proves she doesn't even care either. Haley has every right to be friends with Lindsey. That's not my issue. My issue is with her weird, insensitive actions concerning Peyton. She really doesn't care about how Peyton feels about all of this and if Peyton remotely doesn't act like Lindsey is a Goddess Haley will come with claws ready to attack Peyton. No, just no.

Originally Posted by Betty Again....I wish she would have shown herself at that book signing! We all know that Lindsey was second choice and he wouldn't be with her if he knew Peyton was there.

I know it.

Originally Posted by Betty You notice that?

Originally Posted by Betty He was finally being a dad again.

Jamie was loving it so much, too.

[jediwands]

5.3

Originally Posted by Betty Does anyone else feel that Lucas is a little too quick to declare his love for a woman? It seems to come out of his mouth a little too easily. Does anyone (even if you are not a Leyton fan) feel any chemistry when Lucas and Lindsey are together?

I see zero chemistry. It's tough to watch. I see more romantic chemistry between Lucas and Haley and they're not even romantic.

Originally Posted by Betty Lindsey no doubt feels threatened by Peyton. Lucas staying up all night writing.....the TIMING....the TIMING!!

Indeed!

Originally Posted by Betty Haley!!!!!!! Seriously....when did she drink the Kool aide? This is not the first time she is meeting Lindsey for lunch? Seriously?

I know. I honestly don't get it. I think Haley's just acting so out of character concerning this situation and it drives me nuts.

Originally Posted by Betty Speaking of prison....I know I am often a bleeding heart....but I felt a little sorry for Dan. I have to admit that he did give Nathan some good advice. Watching Dan look at Jamie's photo was a little heartbreaking.

I am with you... I am not only a bleeding heart but a bleeding heart liberal so you can imagine my reaction to this.

Originally Posted by Betty The new Ravens! How can they be so bad? Seriously...I always wondered why players (even pros) can have so much trouble with free throws. From my own experience with my kids....by the time you get to varsity...you have clocked many many years starting from pre-school to jr leagues to traveling club teams. Lots of training and practice. Why wouldn't these players be able to shoot 3 free throws in a row?

Well, I can tell you as a four year varsity basketball player (who played traveling since I was 8 years old) that either you have it or you don't. It doesn't seem possible but it's true. Shaq, Tim Duncan, they both had/have difficulty shooting free throws in general, let alone making 3 in a row. Shaq's overall percentage was like 30/40%, it was badddddddd.

So usually the ones who have trouble are taller players. Not always but usually. Like I said, you either have it or you don't though. I am sure Duncan has spent countless hours and hours attempting to get that part of his game better and he hasn't improved a great deal.

Originally Posted by Betty Mouth and his boss really don't interest me.

I know, I'm bored to tears with this.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by Shelby Yeah it's nice seeing Brooke finally grown up, she changed a lot in those four years.

She is really like two different people. She is one way in seasons 1-4 and an entirely different way in season 5 and on. Yes, she has changed, she has definitely changed the most out of any other character I think and that even includes Nathan.

Originally Posted by Shelby Agreed. I get that it was tough for Lucas to hear a "not right now" after building it up in his head all the way there but come on man! She didn't say she doesn't love you, in fact her response showed more confidence in their relationship than his did. That's the thing. I guess the writers felt they did give LP a wedge that wasn't another character, it was the fact the proposal didn't go as planed and they were across country from each other. Had the season picked up right off that would have been the wedge but since it skipped ahead 4 years, I assume they felt it unrealistic for them both to still be single and not together so Lindsay was the answer. Again to me it never bothered me because it was clear she wasn't sticking around, she was just a vehicle for telling the Lucas Peyton story. Which is ironic, since Lindsay was in fact the person to share their story with the world through his book....oh how the web weaves....

Excellent thoughts.

[jediwands]

5.3

- Notice Lucas pauses when he tells Lindsey he hasn't felt this energized (writing) since his last book. All of this energy = love for Peyton Sawyer.

- Haley questioning Lucas about Lindsey and making sure she's okay with Peyton/Lucas irritates me so much. I honestly think Haley didn't want Lucas to help Peyton with her career because these days, Haley prefers Lindsey over Peyton. I am just not a fan of this.

- Lindsey's at least smart enough to realize that the timing of Lucas' writing inspiration has to do with Peyton's return. But I can't get over being bothered by Haley acting like she is best, best friends with Lindsey and Peyton is way secondary. Hmm, if I remember correctly, Hales, Peyton helped you big time with Nathan in season 1 when you were lost and confused.

- Oh Nanny Carrie...

- Wow, Nathan going to see Dan was great stuff. It's obvious Dan wants to be in Jamie's life. I don't blame Nathan for going to visit Dan. I am actually shocked it took him 4 years. See, what Lucas needs to understand is Nathan had an entirely different relationship with their father and that needs to be noted. Lucas never truly had Dan in his life for any consistent time period. Nathan had Dan for years and years. They have two different father/son dynamics. Thus, it makes sense Nathan would feel an urge to visit his father just as much as it makes sense Lucas doesn't have that urge.

Nathan acting like he is rejecting his father is not really what he's doing either and Dan knows it. Dan telling him he loves him after Nathan leaves... what is wrong with me? I feel for Dan, I can't help it.

- Why on earth would Lindsey go visit Peyton? I find it annoying as hell.

- I love watching Lucas and Skills coach the Ravens. I love this so much. I do wish we find out where the hell Whitey is at the moment. Oh I know he retired but where is he? What's he up to?

- Jamie's shrine for Nathan is so sweet.

- I even enjoy the Brooke/Lucas scenes now.

- The Haley/Peyton scene bothers me so damn much. Of course Haley is on Lindsey's side. Haley, you bothered me less when you went on tour!!!!!!

- Brooke got the house and the roast.

- I thought that lead singer of the band Peyton wanted to add on was Kevin Federline.

- Here's the start of "Hello, my name is Lindsay, I thoroughly enjoy playing the victim." Sorry, she had no business seeking out Peyton and giving her a gift. Who does that? Seriously? Who the hell does that? In what world does a woman go seek out the ex of your boyfriend just to make nice when there's no reason to go there? It's even insulting. Doesn't happen! It's weird and ridiculous but of course Peyton's made out to be in the wrong and Lindsey enjoys her victim role.

- Love how Nathan and Jamie were dressed up and had dinner ready.

- Brooke buying a place and sharing with Peyton is so sweet.

- Awe, Nathan left behind a picture of Jamie for Dan. That was such a nice thing for Nathan to do.

- YAY Peyton gets her first band to sign on even if it's K-Fed!

- Lucas you so lied to Lindsey about her having nothing to worry about. Not that I care but just pointing it out. LOL

-

PEYTON : Look at the view. Look, this place is beautiful, but... BROOKE : But? PEYTON : I just worry I'm keeping you from your life. I know you came down here for me. BROOKE : You know, in New York, I had everything I thought I wanted... money, celebrity, success. But you know what I didn't have? Sunrise with my best friend.

^^^ Aweeeeeeeeeeeeeee, the very best exchange of the episode.

Go away, Victoria! I love how Peyton said she's still a bitch.

[everwoodfan52]

- Notice Lucas pauses when he tells Lindsey he hasn't felt this energized (writing) since his last book. All of this energy = love for Peyton Sawyer.

Oh yes...a huge pause..

I honestly think Haley didn't want Lucas to help Peyton with her career because these days, Haley prefers Lindsey over Peyton. I am just not a fan of this.

I know!! I want to slap some sense into Haley. Where the hell is her loyalty to this woman (Peyton) who has been a wonderful friend! Lindsey just showed up! She hasn't earned Haley's loyalty yet!

- Oh Nanny Carrie...

I can definitely see the writing on the wall...

Thus, it makes sense Nathan would feel an urge to visit his father just as much as it makes sense Lucas doesn't have that urge.

Of course! Dan is both Lucas and Nathan's dad, but he has been actively Nathan's dad since Nathan's birth. This guy (for better or worse) raised Nathan. It's very tough not to acknowledge Dan whatsoever.

Nathan acting like he is rejecting his father is not really what he's doing either and Dan knows it. Dan telling him he loves him after Nathan leaves... what is wrong with me? I feel for Dan, I can't help it.

I know!! I wanted to cry for Dan! What is wrong with both of us?!?

- I love watching Lucas and Skills coach the Ravens. I love this so much. I do wish we find out where the hell Whitey is at the moment. Oh I know he retired but where is he? What's he up to?

Does Whitey ever come back? For that matter...does Karen ever come back?

- Jamie's shrine for Nathan is so sweet.

He is so precious!

- I even enjoy the Brooke/Lucas scenes now.

Yes. No more drama. They are friends.

-

Here's the start of "Hello, my name is Lindsay, I thoroughly enjoy playing the victim." Sorry, she had no business seeking out Peyton

It's like she's constantly in Peyton's face rubbing it in.

- Love how Nathan and Jamie were dressed up and had dinner ready.

What a handsome pair. Haley is one lucky woman!

- Awe, Nathan left behind a picture of Jamie for Dan. That was such a nice thing for Nathan to do.

Yes! Again...very moving and heartbreaking.

- Lucas you so lied to Lindsey about her having nothing to worry about. Not that I care but just pointing it out. LOL

He didn't convince me.
-

[break the window]

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) I love Peyton's words to Nathan. This is something that's always been consistent on the show... they were horrific romantically together but became great friends after that.

Peyton could always be honest with Nathan. That's what he needed. Nathan was feeling bad for himself because he couldn't be Great Nathan Scott and be able to shoot a basket a hundred feet from the hoop. He needed to be reminded of what he already had and what he's pushing away.

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) That scene annoys me so damn much. Haley should never have put Peyton in such an uncomfortable situation. I love how Brooke tried to go all best friend with Peyton... it's like Brooke knew intuitively to get Peyton in the mix immediately given the uncomfortable situation that was already in play thanks to Haley. Poor Peyton gets out of there. That wasn't necessary as Lindsey never should have been called over in the first place.

I'm really wondering if Haley forgot the love that Lucas had for Peyton. She knew he was crazy about Peyton Sawyer before anybody else. It's always been there. Then it's kind of like she forgot about her friendship with Peyton and thought it was easy to blend Lindsey and Peyton together like everyone would be gal pals. It as really frustrating having Haley be Lucas' best friend, loving Lindsey and putting that on everyone else. She was definitely not my favorite that year.

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) Notice Lucas doesn't even want to answer questions about Lindsey to Peyton. All he wants to focus in on is why she didn't come to the book signing... or so he thinks at that moment she didn't come... yes, right, you're over Peyton, Luke. LOL

It was easy to forget about Peyton when Lucas wasn't with her. But then the second he knows she's back all the feelings and questions come back. Why didn't she come to the book signing. Why did she say no to his proposal. All these ideas of why they aren't together. It's like Lucas wants answers from Peyton and nothing to do with him being with Lindsey.

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) Lucas/Peyton once again alone together... they just can't stay away... I love that Peyton told Lucas she DID come to his book signing. She was there. I would bet if Lucas would have known that they would have immediately reunited but no, Lindsey as an editor had to kiss him awkwardly with Peyton seeing that. Of course, roadblock, wedge, ick.

Not only was it that kiss from Lucas/Lindsey, she also bumped into Julian in Los Angeles and they started their thing. Peyton was so insecure thinking that she could make everything work with Lucas being in Tree Hill and her doing the internship in Los Angeles. It was like she saw one thing to derail her emotions and she let it. I found it sad that Peyton let everything she and Lucas had/went through be washed away in one simple moment.

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) Lucas also looks devastated finding out Peyton WAS at the book signing.

Peyton did care enough to come but obvious Lucas had other ideas about why he wanted her there. It broke his heart knowing that Peyton did care but didn't think he wanted her there.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by Betty Oh yes...a huge pause..

It was so obvious.

Originally Posted by Betty I know!! I want to slap some sense into Haley. Where the hell is her loyalty to this woman (Peyton) who has been a wonderful friend! Lindsey just showed up! She hasn't earned Haley's loyalty yet!

I honestly don't understand and it annoys me greatly. It's like Haley forgot all about the Lucas/Peyton history or her friendship with Peyton. She almost sees Peyton as an outsider who is a threat to precious Lindsey. That's how it's coming across. I couldn't care less that Peyton's been gone for 4 years. That doesn't erase your friendship or history. It's irritating. Peyton did so much for Nathan and Haley and this is how she gets treated? Trust me, it's only going to get worse too. Keep watching.

Originally Posted by Betty I can definitely see the writing on the wall...

You can tell Haley knows it's a mistake because she keeps talking about her hotness and her hesitancy. It's not about the hotness... I think she's thinking about it because deep down she knows it was the wrong choice. Too bad she can't see the situation with Peyton/Lindsey more clearly.

Originally Posted by Betty Of course! Dan is both Lucas and Nathan's dad, but he has been actively Nathan's dad since Nathan's birth. This guy (for better or worse) raised Nathan. It's very tough not to acknowledge Dan whatsoever.

Very tough, especially since whether you believe it or not, prison is termed as being "rehabilitation" so he's technically getting help too. Not saying what Dan did compares to a non-violent alcoholic entering rehab. I just mean Dan is paying for his crime right now. He took responsibility and he's paying for it, doing the time. He's done what he can do to ultimately face up to the horrendous act he committed. He also has a Grandson. It's a complicated situation. I don't blame Nathan for opening up to Dan some, going to see him. I really don't.

Originally Posted by Betty I know!! I wanted to cry for Dan! What is wrong with both of us?!?

I don't know, I guess we're hopeless.

Originally Posted by Betty Does Whitey ever come back? For that matter...does Karen ever come back?

Honestly, I am not sure but I think we see both of them again. I don't remember how regularly we see Karen, but I know we see Whitey at least once since I remember the episode.

Originally Posted by Betty Yes. No more drama. They are friends.

I know, right? No romantic crap, no triangle, just plain comfortable friendship... that is what Lucas/Brooke should have always been about. It feels right.

Originally Posted by Betty It's like she's constantly in Peyton's face rubbing it in.

Exactly! Get away from her! I couldn't care less if it turned out that the stupid plant was being nice. I don't care. I still think you're right and she was rubbing it in or that's what it appears. Truth of the matter is she had no business going near Peyton on her own like that. Again, who does that? It's one thing to bump into Peyton when you're with Lucas or your new, dedicated, loyal BFF, Haley () and you see Peyton and are forced to say a kind hello. But what she did was ridiculous.

Betty, are you on 5.4?

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by Patricia Peyton could always be honest with Nathan. That's what he needed. Nathan was feeling bad for himself because he couldn't be Great Nathan Scott and be able to shoot a basket a hundred feet from the hoop. He needed to be reminded of what he already had and what he's pushing away.

Exactly and Peyton started that process with him so he could start seeing the light.

Originally Posted by Patricia I'm really wondering if Haley forgot the love that Lucas had for Peyton. She knew he was crazy about Peyton Sawyer before anybody else. It's always been there. Then it's kind of like she forgot about her friendship with Peyton and thought it was easy to blend Lindsey and Peyton together like everyone would be gal pals. It as really frustrating having Haley be Lucas' best friend, loving Lindsey and putting that on everyone else. She was definitely not my favorite that year.

YES! I can't stand this. I really can't. Haley's behavior and thought process regarding this situation is dead wrong. She should consult Jamie about it. I bet even little Jamie could tell her what she's doing wrong!

Originally Posted by Patricia It was easy to forget about Peyton when Lucas wasn't with her. But then the second he knows she's back all the feelings and questions come back. Why didn't she come to the book signing. Why did she say no to his proposal. All these ideas of why they aren't together. It's like Lucas wants answers from Peyton and nothing to do with him being with Lindsey.

Exactly and the fact that he's so consumed with getting the answers proves he's not over Peyton. This is not an ex totally over the other just wanting information to close the chapter. You can tell it's about so much more for Lucas, especially since he had writer's block and suddenly receives a few words from Peyton as he inhales their romantic connection and bam, it produced such life within him again... as a result, he started pounding on his keyboard endless words... looks like Peyton cured his writer's block.

Originally Posted by Patricia Not only was it that kiss from Lucas/Lindsey, she also bumped into Julian in Los Angeles and they started their thing. Peyton was so insecure thinking that she could make everything work with Lucas being in Tree Hill and her doing the internship in Los Angeles. It was like she saw one thing to derail her emotions and she let it. I found it sad that Peyton let everything she and Lucas had/went through be washed away in one simple moment. Peyton did care enough to come but obvious Lucas had other ideas about why he wanted her there. It broke his heart knowing that Peyton did care but didn't think he wanted her there.

I know it's so sad. I wish Peyton would have texted him shortly after the book signing and told him she was there but saw the kiss and didn't feel comfortable staying unsure of what was going on between Lucas and Lindsey. He would have told her nothing was going on, then they'd meet up and reunite. It should have happened that way.

[everwoodfan52]

Trust me, it's only going to get worse too. Keep watching.

No! How can it get worse than this?!

Betty, are you on 5.4?

I watched it and will comment about it shortly.

How about you?

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) No! How can it get worse than this?! I watched it and will comment about it shortly. How about you?

I screwed that up. It probably doesn't get worse, it just lingers and there will be more moments with Haley choosing Lindsey over Peyton. I keep thinking back to how Peyton took Haley in and embraced her no questions asked. Peyton even had to watch Nathan fall for Haley and treat her with kindness and respect which is something Peyton hardly received from Nathan. While Brooke was less accepting of Haley initially, even with everything involved Peyton took her in and accepted her, giving her excellent advice on Nathan. Peyton gave Haley tough love upon her return from the tour but we saw how Peyton went there to HELP Nathan/Haley.

You would think Haley would return some of that back to Peyton instead of this silly girl crush on Lindsey.

I'm on 5.4 and will watch after my meeting!

[everwoodfan52]

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) I. I keep thinking back to how Peyton took Haley in and embraced her no questions asked. Peyton even had to watch Nathan fall for Haley and treat her with kindness and respect which is something Peyton hardly received from Nathan. You would think Haley would return some of that back to Peyton instead of this silly girl crush on Lindsey. !

I know! Peyton showed absolutely no jealousy when Nathan and Haley got together. She just accepted the fact that Haley was better for him and that Nathan became a better man. She even gave Haley advice about sex!
Now I'm more pissed at Haley than ever!

[everwoodfan52]

5.4


See....even Haley hates mullets.

Nathan: "I know we don't have to worry about money."
Why is that? Beginning teacher's salary is not that great and it's too soon for Nathan to have a settlement on his injury. Where's the money coming from?

Mouth......wtf?!? Seriously....what has happened to you?!? This storyline has to end.
Mouth....why don't you consider dating Brooke's assistant? She seems like a really nice possiblity.

Is it possible to hate Victoria more than Dan? I believe it is.

Brooke is so sweet and too generous!

Kevin Federline.....no need to say more. Good riddance.


Haley seeing Jamie's drawing.....This is a sign, Haley. Get rid of her!!!!

Quentin....I know it's inevitable that he will come around. But....it's really tough to like him at this point.
Get your freaking feet off of Lucas's desk...you disrespectful creep!
I am glad to see Nathan involved...love seeing him around basketball in any capacity.
It was interesting advice Nathan gave Quentin regarding the fade away shot. Wasn't it Lucas who gave an arrogant Nathan that same advice awhile back?

Lindsey....you really should worry. Peyton is not going away and Lucas's feelings for Peyton are not going away, either!

[cowgirl08]

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) 5.4 Nathan: "I know we don't have to worry about money." Why is that? Beginning teacher's salary is not that great and it's too soon for Nathan to have a settlement on is injury. Where's the money coming from?

I had the same thought but didn't post it in my notes on this episode since I was ahead and didn't want to spoil you on the injury thing. He signed that shoe deal which probably came with guaranteed money upfront - maybe it was a really big signing bonus? Unless I missed something that's all I could come up with.