[secretk]

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) . I didn't realize Nathan and Haley weren't planned from the beginning. They definitely have a lot of chemistry. I love watching them (when they're in a good place).

Yes this is what I meant. Not that Naley weren't endgame, but that Leyton were that special couple for him and were in his heart. And he planned Leyton from the start - hence the Pilot. Natan and Haley don't even communicate in the first few episodes. You could tell that they were not envisioned in the earliest ideas of OTH. This doesn't mean that Mark didn't care about them. He wrote great storylines for them.

What I meant is that Leyton for Mark and OTH was what Amy/Ephram were for Berlanti and Everwood. And Lucas/Nathan dynamics for OTH was what Andy/Ephram dynamics was for Everwood. I think those two are really good parallels.

ETA: Additional comments

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) You're welcome, Koni! I'm glad to see that you are watching Season 5.

I haven't watched still the episode. I just remember it .

Yeah...but I don't believe I'll be thrilled with the information.

True you won't be.

Regarding the reaction it depends. I usually don't hate characters that are in Lindsay situations. It's not about how much I love Leyton. It's about me beign green alien . No seriously my favorite TV couple is Liz/Maz from Roswell. Now there is a character Tess there that was like the third wheel when it came to this couple. The most hated character in Roswell. It's hated as much as Madison. Maybe even more. Tess not only got pregnant from Max, she also managed to cause a death of major character. I still don't hate her. I can't. I don't even hate the storyline. I see how this showed how much bigger the love of Max and Liz is actually. So yeah it depends on the way you look at things.

She realized that she does have that integrity that Lucas says she has. I'm so happy she woke up and resigned. That boss was a super creep and she should have charged him with Sexual harassment.

I think that it was perfect example for Sexual harassment.

Yes...you and me both!

To continue what my intention was with my comment above is that I think that Nathan even trying to threaten to kill Lucas is messing up big time with their brotherhood and dynamics. This is what I didn't like. For me this comment was far worse than any comment he did in Season 1. In Season 1 Lucas didn't love Nathan and didn't give a damn that his brother the jerk is insulting him. In Season 5 Lucas loved Nathan. To hear him something like that it was awful. Lucas managed to stay calm to be honest. He did more than I expected.

[everwoodfan52]

What I meant is that Leyton for Mark and OTH was what Amy/Ephram were for Berlanti and Everwood. And Lucas/Nathan dynamics for OTH was what Andy/Ephram dynamics was for Everwood. I think those two are really good parallels.

Yes, that is a good parallel.


Well, Koni, have you decided to continue watching the series?

[ds44]

from what I understood Naley were never the plan, but when he decided to play with them to further lucas/Nathan angst, he decided to stick with them.

[everwoodfan52]

It's about me beign green alien

If you say so, Koni. Now I finally understand.

In Season 5 Lucas loved Nathan. To hear him something like that it was awful. Lucas managed to stay calm to be honest. He did more than I expected.

Lucas is a forgiving guy. He realized that Nathan was in a really dark place and was talking out of his ass! It doesn't justify what he said, However.

from what I understood Naley were never the plan, but when he decided to play with them to further lucas/Nathan angst, he decided to stick with them.

Really good move on his part!

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) . I didn't realize Nathan and Haley weren't planned from the beginning. They definitely have a lot of chemistry. I love watching them (when they're in a good place).

Nope they weren't. Lucas/Peyton were only.

I watched a Mark interview with him talking about this subject. He said they were a pleasant surprise given the James and Joy chemistry. He said he wrote in Naley after deciding he had to go with the actors chemistry. What Shu said too as well. It was a win/win.

[jediwands]

For the vast majority of fans, it's only natural to not like Lindsey kind of characters. As diehard Lucas/Peyton fans, we just got finished seeing them make it beautifully in season 4. The finale of 4 was so beautiful for them, you saw how perfectly Lucas/Peyton worked in season 4 romantically after the triangle was over for good. You saw how meant to be they were. They were doing perfectly in the finale of 4. Then all of a sudden in the premiere of 5, we have to digest that 4 years later they are broken up and Lucas is engaged to marry someone else? It's natural for Betty to have that kind of ticked off reaction and that's how the vast majority of the Lucas/Peyton fanbase reacts to seeing it.

Mark definitely gave Nathan/Haley breaks in the sense that they were hardly apart when they've had their drama. Season 2 is the exception and quite frankly, that entire season sucked when you consider all the main storylines. By far, it's the worst season of the series. But other than season 2, Nathan/Haley have had issues, even major issues, but Mark never separated them or had one of them engaged to someone else even knowing they are still meant to be. It's clear Mark planned Lucas/Peyton from day 1. It's also clear they would be the tortured soulmate Ephram/Amy pairing, too. Good news that they were written like Ephram/Amy. Bad news is triangles and Lindsey's were roadblocks temporarily.

But yes, I do think the diehards of Lucas/Peyton 9 1/2 out of 10 times will react like Betty did. Lindsey is not set up to be liked. Lindsey is not really set up to even be a true character when it's all said and done. She was never a permanent fixture on this show. She came in for one reason and one reason alone and that's to basically upset Lucas/Peyton fans while we wait for our couple to figure things out.

[everwoodfan52]

5.2


Okay…it looks like they’re still walking into each other’s bedrooms. Lindsey better get used to that.

I love Jamie with Skills. They’re like two kids. Lol

Jamie and Brooke are also wonderful together! “I’m glad you’re my godmother.” Awe……

Mouth’s boss is a creep. Mouth doesn’t have the face to be a field reporter? Has his boss ever looked in the mirror?
Seriously…where’s Deb’s gun?!? On that note….where’s Deb?

I know Nathan is being an Ass and he did make stupid choices. But…it’s tough to blame him for being bitter. He was so close to seeing his dream come true. His behavior, though, is over the top horrible.

Haley did not need to announce right off the bat that this was her first class, and she was obviously nervous. That doesn’t excuse Quentin…who is definitely a creep. He’s a lot like Nathan was season one. Unfortunately…the class seems to take his lead and they were all obnoxious.

Peyton…why didn’t you show yourself to Lucas at that book signing?!? He wasn’t dating Lindsey yet!

Lucas to the the Ravens…”You want our credentials…they’re hanging right there.” That was awesome.

Welcome Nanny Melissa….oh…I mean Carrie. I know she is bad news if you called her the female Derek. I’m ready! Lol

Okay….did Brooke spend the night with Mouth? Community beds are alive and well.

Did Haley have to be a fan girl and call Lindsey over…knowing that Peyton was there? A bit insensitive…I’d say. Poor Peyton had to walk away.

I love that Peyton told Lucas that his art mattered…it’s come full circle. It’s not a coincidence that Lucas was ready to resume writing soon after that. It wasn’t Lindsey who gave him that insentive.

Glad Haley was finally firm with the class and put her foot down with Quentin. He’s going to have to earn his way back on the team.

Nathan should have gone to that derby race with Jamie. I’m glad Haley told him off big time. He’s needs major tough love.

So glad that Nathan came around in the end. He on his wheelchair racing Jamie in his car was super!

It’s nice to see the gang all working in Tree Hill….Peyton, Brooke, Skills, Lucas, Haley…like old times.

[jediwands]

Betty, can you check Netflix right now? Can you get on? I cannot get on using my laptop, phone Internet or iPad. Weird deal, first time this has ever happened.

It's super slow and still won't connect. So weird... and frustrating!

[everwoodfan52]

Originally Posted by Mich1111 (View Post) Betty, can you check Netflix right now? Can you get on? I cannot get on using my laptop, phone Internet or iPad. Weird deal, first time this has ever happened. It's super slow and still won't connect. So weird... and frustrating!

I just called the helpline number and a recording said that they are having technical difficulties and are working on it.
I thought it was my computer!

[jediwands]

Universal issue:

We are currently experiencing issues streaming on all devices. We are working to resolve the problem. We apologize for any inconvenience.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I wanted to watch before Pretty Little Liars.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by everwoodfan52 (View Post) I just called the helpline number and a recording said that they are having technical difficulties and are working on it. I thought it was my computer!

Yessss, so did I! Well, I thought something was weird because it was three different devices I was using but still thought maybe just in my area. But yes, it's Netflix in general. This sucks!!!!!

[cowgirl08]

5x5

Watching Lucas in the flashback of the college game as a coach is hilarious. Taking over Whitey's job.....aww how he just walked off the court knowing Lucas could handle it.

Aww the flashback to the confetti scene. It's you. These are the scenes I am talking about. Listen I don't hate Lindsey she seems like a lovely gal but she never once gave me the impression she was taking over Peyton's place....never. Why would the show still be sure and put in little LP moments in every episode even when they aren't together. Duh because the show knows they are endgame and is only using Lindsey as a means to further their story. I just can't get over the fact people actually were threatened by Lindsey? Seriously?

This whole flashback just kinda shows how Lucas and Peyton are in such different places in their life. The love is there but Peyton is where a 19 year old typically is, starting at the bottom and trying desperately to work her way up. While Lucas is already getting a full-time salary and benefits as a head college coach? It's a lot easier for him to propose settling down than it is for her. It sucks but I get why she couldn't answer.

I was mad at him until he offered to move but she knows he would resent it. They are too young. She isn't saying NO, she is saying "in another year."

"If you can't trust that our love can make it a year how can we be talking about forever right now?" Precisely Peyton, precisely. If only he had seen it that way then too.


Aww and his dream comes true the moment he says goodbye to the person he wants to share it with. Life is harsh that way.

Even Lindsey is a Lucas and Peyton fan.

Good to see Brooke learned her lesson about sleeping with Peyton's recent exes. When did Brooke become the one with all the wisdom on this show?

And look at that it's Lucas who gave Lindsey the bamboo plant, I forgot about that nugget.

Yeah you are totally over Peyton Lucas that's why you still have her ring. Keep telling yourself that.

"You still love her don't you?" Bahaha tell him Brooke.

[jediwands]

Will respond to your great thoughts while I wait for Netflix to get working again:

Originally Posted by Betty 5.2 Okay…it looks like they’re still walking into each other’s bedrooms. Lindsey better get used to that.

I love Jamie with Skills. They’re like two kids. Lol

LOL They are adorable, they have a special dynamic.

Jamie and Brooke are also wonderful together! “I’m glad you’re my godmother.” Awe……

I love them, too!

Mouth’s boss is a creep. Mouth doesn’t have the face to be a field reporter? Has his boss ever looked in the mirror? Seriously…where’s Deb’s gun?!? On that note….where’s Deb?

You will see her this season. Not much is ever known about what she was up to during the missing years (past 4) but she's clean still. But yes, you'll eventually see her in season 5.

I know Nathan is being an Ass and he did make stupid choices. But…it’s tough to blame him for being bitter. He was so close to seeing his dream come true. His behavior, though, is over the top horrible. Haley did not need to announce right off the bat that this was her first class, and she was obviously nervous. That doesn’t excuse Quentin…who is definitely a creep. He’s a lot like Nathan was season one. Unfortunately…the class seems to take his lead and they were all obnoxious.

Agreed, agreed, agreed.

Peyton…why didn’t you show yourself to Lucas at that book signing?!? He wasn’t dating Lindsey yet!

I wish she would have. It kind of reminds me of Ephram and the postcards. He loved Amy from a distance, same with Peyton loving Lucas from a distance right now.

Lucas to the the Ravens…”You want our credentials…they’re hanging right there.” That was awesome. Welcome Nanny Melissa….oh…I mean Carrie. I know she is bad news if you called her the female Derek. I’m ready! Lol

Right? Don't you see Melissa?

Okay….did Brooke spend the night with Mouth? Community beds are alive and well.

Thank you for this comment:

Did Haley have to be a fan girl and call Lindsey over…knowing that Peyton was there? A bit insensitive…I’d say. Poor Peyton had to walk away.

Exactly. Haley was ridiculous calling over her Mary Sue aka Lindsey like that knowing Peyton was there. It was a stupid move. Lame. Haley's smarter than that. Trust me, this isn't the last time you wonder if Haley selectively forgot the Lucas/Peyton history. I love you, Haley, but you irritate me regarding this situation. I felt so sorry for Peyton having to quickly get away. Poor Peyton. Haley's fan girl crap with Lindsey could have waited. Thank you for picking up on that! Be prepared to be annoyed in other instances too.

I love that Peyton told Lucas that his art mattered…it’s come full circle. It’s not a coincidence that Lucas was ready to resume writing soon after that. It wasn’t Lindsey who gave him that insentive.

Why do you think you can't analyze? You pick up on things so easily.

Glad Haley was finally firm with the class and put her foot down with Quentin. He’s going to have to earn his way back on the team. Nathan should have gone to that derby race with Jamie. I’m glad Haley told him off big time. He’s needs major tough love. So glad that Nathan came around in the end. He on his wheelchair racing Jamie in his car was super! It’s nice to see the gang all working in Tree Hill….Peyton, Brooke, Skills, Lucas, Haley…like old times.

Yes, yes and more yes to all of that!

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by cowgirl08 (View Post) 5x5 Watching Lucas in the flashback of the college game as a coach is hilarious. Taking over Whitey's job.....aww how he just walked off the court knowing Lucas could handle it. Aww the flashback to the confetti scene. It's you. These are the scenes I am talking about. Listen I don't hate Lindsey she seems like a lovely gal but she never once gave me the impression she was taking over Peyton's place....never. Why would the show still be sure and put in little LP moments in every episode even when they aren't together. Duh because the show knows they are endgame and is only using Lindsey as a means to further their story. I just can't get over the fact people actually were threatened by Lindsey? Seriously? This whole flashback just kinda shows how Lucas and Peyton are in such different places in their life. The love is there but Peyton is where a 19 year old typically is, starting at the bottom and trying desperately to work her way up. While Lucas is already getting a full-time salary and benefits as a head college coach? It's a lot easier for him to propose settling down than it is for her. It sucks but I get why she couldn't answer. I was mad at him until he offered to move but she knows he would resent it. They are too young. She isn't saying NO, she is saying "in another year." "If you can't trust that our love can make it a year how can we be talking about forever right now?" Precisely Peyton, precisely. If only he had seen it that way then too. Aww and his dream comes true the moment he says goodbye to the person he wants to share it with. Life is harsh that way. Even Lindsey is a Lucas and Peyton fan. Good to see Brooke learned her lesson about sleeping with Peyton's recent exes. When did Brooke become the one with all the wisdom on this show? And look at that it's Lucas who gave Lindsey the bamboo plant, I forgot about that nugget. Yeah you are totally over Peyton Lucas that's why you still have her ring. Keep telling yourself that. "You still love her don't you?" Bahaha tell him Brooke.

Great thoughts. I absolutely love Brooke in season 5. I just love her.

Great point about Lucas and Peyton being at different places too concerning career and such. I have yet to read a comment saying Peyton should have said yes and was wrong not to. It made serious sense for her to not be able to answer.

I wasn't threatened by Lindsey... I just don't want her on my screen. It's just such a downer given what we saw in season 4 and then now we're back to this crap with the obstacles for Lucas/Peyton. It's tiring. Yes, I was never threatened by Lindsey, I just didn't like to deal with this storyline. It's just wasted space. Everyone knows Lucas/Peyton are ending up together so find a more clever way of going there besides Lucas acting like CMM himself LOL and proposing to someone he has no business proposing to. I just wish Mark would have found more Naley-like ways to insert drama for Lucas/Peyton instead of using Lindsey. That's why I can't take her seriously which means I can't feel for her in the library, either. She's like a robotic wedge but an annoying wedge at that because I feel like another route could have taken place to keep things interesting and still push the Lucas/Peyton story.

[jediwands]

Netflix is working again!

Problem I have now is Wild hockey, Pretty Little Liars but I will watch in a bit!