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Old 03-07-2005, 04:59 AM
  #136
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I had this all written out on Friday, planning to post it as soon as I got home and I completely forgot until now! Here it is anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Brightside
THe problem with most of these arguments is that most of you are quoting lines ... and what were trying to get at is ... Dawson was villainized for the sake of P/J getting together.
But I've already posted why that isn't necessarily so.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Brightside
It was obviously forcefully written that way ... and while Pacey came off as the sweet guy, who would accept loss ...
But that IS Pacey!!! Isn't that what Pacey did before he even kissed Joey? Didn't he accept loss in Neverland when he agreed the kiss was a mistake? Like it or not Pacey acted in character. This how he's always been!
Why is this point being ignored? Pacey has always let Joey dictate the pace or outcome of their (potential) relationship.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Brightside
Dawson came off as kniving, ruthless ... and basically, his character was put through the rinse cycle ... not giving him a real chance to have it be an equal triangle
Because...that is what he's like when he feels threatened or someone behaves contrary to how he expectes them to! He staged the anti-prom to get what he wanted just like he staged kissing Jen in S1. He withdrew his friendship and affection from Joey just like he did when he found out Jen wasn't a virgin and when he found out Joey knew Gale was cheating on Mitch. He flew off the handle throwing insults and accusations around just like he did when he accused Pacey of sleeping with Joey in Four To Tango and stealing the PSAT. This IS how Dawson reacts.

It could never be an equal triangle because Joey wasn't torn between romantic feelings for Dawson and romantic feelings for Pacey. She was emotionally blackmailed into choosing her friendship with Dawson over her romantic feelings for Pacey. It really was no contest right from the beginning. He was a loser from the start and he made himself seem even more of a loser by the way he chose to react to P/J getting together.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Brightside
why did Dawson have to be written down so Pacey could be written up? That's what I don't understand ... everything else being mentioned is entirely irrelevant to me.
What would be the same level, though? Both acting like what? Dawson's behaviour from The Longest Day onwards is very reminiscent of previous behaviour in his history. I think that's relevant to your question as to why he was supposedly written down and if he was written down then it wasn't by much.



Quote:
Originally Posted by COOLCAT200
Well, why should she of ended up with a guy she showed almost zero romantic feelings toward for a season and a half followed by a few weeks of her coming out of it saying ''Even When everything's Perfect being with you does not feel right?''
Didn't I cover this in my last post? I think I did, but I'll repeat it here. That's why it made so much sense when KW said that he just couldn't see Dawson and Joey living day to day together because they were never able to sustain a relationshop together. Pacey and Joey did AND they were able to stay friends and whenever they'd been apart they always came together again with a sense of ease and comfort and affection that was just natural - just there. So KW had to change it to the couple that DID make sense.

First of all, Joey had to end up with either Dawson and Pacey. Those were her 2 choices. The only 2 choices. So, KW had to choose the most plausible most viable couple. And, oh, how I love the definition of viable...
capable of life or normal growth and development.'
Dawson and Joey have always shown themselves to be the complete opposite of viable, throughout the whole of their romantic history.
That is why she 'ended up with a guy she showed almost zero romantic feelings toward for a season and a half followed by a few weeks of her coming out of it saying ''Even When everything's Perfect being with you does not feel right.'
Plus the fact that she made it clear that she alway knew deep down that it was Pacey. She just wasn't ready for him.



Quote:
Originally Posted by COOLCAT200
Love Bites Ruined anything with P/J romantic I think but the same could be said about 602. I could go on but I won't but I do kind of think she out grew both of them to an extent but her not ending up with one of them would have been a big disappointment I guess. The only the thing is according to the Stupin on the DVD he say's some scenes were shot when they thought D/J would end up together. he even goes on to say during the bed room scene ''still some attraction because at this point we still thought they would end up together'' Is Stupin lying?
Lying? Why should he be lying? I don't understand your point here. We already know they kept in scenes that were written or shot or whatever when they still thought D/J would end up together and I know he said there was supposed to still be some attraction in that scene. I bet you'll say that you saw the attraction. I rememeber I saw NO attraction. Just Joey looking really awkward as they resumed their pose of old on the bed. What was telling in that scene was that Joey described her relationship with Christopher and how they met, etc and she could have been describing her relationship with Pacey instead! Also when Dawson said he was scared to close his eyes in case she was gone when he opened them. She told him to close them and when he woke she was gone.



Quote:
Originally Posted by COOLCAT200
Well no because Pacey admitted he could not get rid of his feelings for Joey so him even being there was enough for something to happen because he also said ''When you like someone proximity is a good thing'''
I'm sorry. You seem to have missed the point completely. You're also still making assumptions. It makes no difference that he couldn't get rid of his feelings and we already know he has them. Having such feelings does not automatically mean something would happen. You have to DO something to make it happen and Pacey didn't go to Aunt Gwen's with the intention of making anything happen between himself and Joey. He wasn't expecting it. If he wasn't expecting it then he can't have been planning it, feelings or not! He only went to be near her! That is why he said 'proximity is a good thing,' It meant he could be near her even if she didn't feel the same way, even if he knew nothing could happen. And nothing could happen - unless Joey wanted it to and gave him some indication that she did and as far as he knew she didn't.



Quote:
Originally Posted by COOLCAT200
He said he came to be with her. Now if Joey had not gone would he still of gone? I mean Aunt Gwen made it clear she had not scene Pacey for a long time so I take it he had not joined D/J for a very long time on one of these things.
If Joey hadn't gone there is the possibility that he wouldn't have either, but it's just as likely that he would have done considering that he had Will to entertain. So I think it's more likely he would have gone.
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Old 03-07-2005, 07:22 AM
  #137
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Quote:
I'm sorry. You seem to have missed the point completely. You're also still making assumptions. It makes no difference that he couldn't get rid of his feelings and we already know he has them. Having such feelings does not automatically mean something would happen. You have to DO something to make it happen and Pacey didn't go to Aunt Gwen's with the intention of making anything happen between himself and Joey. He wasn't expecting it. If he wasn't expecting it then he can't have been planning it, feelings or not! He only went to be near her! That is why he said 'proximity is a good thing,' It meant he could be near her even if she didn't feel the same way, even if he knew nothing could happen. And nothing could happen - unless Joey wanted it to and gave him some indication that she did and as far as he knew she didn't.
word. Pacey just wanted to be near her. He did not expect anything. It was her choice for how she wanted things to develop with him like he said in another episode. When she tells him he made her feel alive, then he said he had to kiss her. He said if she didn't want him to, then she would have to stop him. She chose not to, so it was her choice
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Old 03-07-2005, 08:49 AM
  #138
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Jaycee I think you forgot but you already posted all of that. It's on page 9
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Old 03-07-2005, 12:56 PM
  #139
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i love this epi it's so great!!!!
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Old 03-12-2005, 04:11 PM
  #140
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hey,
since this is a season 3 eppy, where did pacey live in season 3 before he went to dougs? I know he mentioned that he left home because his sister came back with the kids but in the thanksgiving eppy he mentions how he was going to his parents house? Also, on that subject, did jen live with grams in season 5 and 6? did jack move back into grams after he got kicked out of the frat? why did he get kicked out? what happened with him and his frat friend that he dated? where did dawson live during season 5 and 6? Did they mention Jack's dad even though they didn't show him? Did they ever mention Joey's dad after he got out of jail in season 5 until merry mayhem? Didn't they mention that Audrey was a **** in season five and slept around but then changed it? what did she and that eliot guy do? after jack got hurt and couldn't play football again, did he mention football again? how come gail told mitch about the affair? in escape from witch island were there really ghosts? were the boat guy and the other lady the ghosts? Thanks for all the help!!!
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Old 03-12-2005, 04:37 PM
  #141
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This Is By Far My Absolut Favourite Episode Of Dc!!!!!!!!!!! I Love It More And More Every Day It Pasts....
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