Jaycee

I had this all written out on Friday, planning to post it as soon as I got home and I completely forgot until now! Here it is anyway.


But I've already posted why that isn't necessarily so.


But that IS Pacey!!! Isn't that what Pacey did before he even kissed Joey? Didn't he accept loss in Neverland when he agreed the kiss was a mistake? Like it or not Pacey acted in character. This how he's always been!
Why is this point being ignored? Pacey has always let Joey dictate the pace or outcome of their (potential) relationship.



Because...that is what he's like when he feels threatened or someone behaves contrary to how he expectes them to! He staged the anti-prom to get what he wanted just like he staged kissing Jen in S1. He withdrew his friendship and affection from Joey just like he did when he found out Jen wasn't a virgin and when he found out Joey knew Gale was cheating on Mitch. He flew off the handle throwing insults and accusations around just like he did when he accused Pacey of sleeping with Joey in Four To Tango and stealing the PSAT. This IS how Dawson reacts.

It could never be an equal triangle because Joey wasn't torn between romantic feelings for Dawson and romantic feelings for Pacey. She was emotionally blackmailed into choosing her friendship with Dawson over her romantic feelings for Pacey. It really was no contest right from the beginning. He was a loser from the start and he made himself seem even more of a loser by the way he chose to react to P/J getting together.



What would be the same level, though? Both acting like what? Dawson's behaviour from The Longest Day onwards is very reminiscent of previous behaviour in his history. I think that's relevant to your question as to why he was supposedly written down and if he was written down then it wasn't by much.



Didn't I cover this in my last post? I think I did, but I'll repeat it here. That's why it made so much sense when KW said that he just couldn't see Dawson and Joey living day to day together because they were never able to sustain a relationshop together. Pacey and Joey did AND they were able to stay friends and whenever they'd been apart they always came together again with a sense of ease and comfort and affection that was just natural - just there. So KW had to change it to the couple that DID make sense.

First of all, Joey had to end up with either Dawson and Pacey. Those were her 2 choices. The only 2 choices. So, KW had to choose the most plausible most viable couple. And, oh, how I love the definition of viable...
capable of life or normal growth and development.'
Dawson and Joey have always shown themselves to be the complete opposite of viable, throughout the whole of their romantic history.
That is why she 'ended up with a guy she showed almost zero romantic feelings toward for a season and a half followed by a few weeks of her coming out of it saying ''Even When everything's Perfect being with you does not feel right.'
Plus the fact that she made it clear that she alway knew deep down that it was Pacey. She just wasn't ready for him.



Lying? Why should he be lying? I don't understand your point here. We already know they kept in scenes that were written or shot or whatever when they still thought D/J would end up together and I know he said there was supposed to still be some attraction in that scene. I bet you'll say that you saw the attraction. I rememeber I saw NO attraction. Just Joey looking really awkward as they resumed their pose of old on the bed. What was telling in that scene was that Joey described her relationship with Christopher and how they met, etc and she could have been describing her relationship with Pacey instead! Also when Dawson said he was scared to close his eyes in case she was gone when he opened them. She told him to close them and when he woke she was gone.



I'm sorry. You seem to have missed the point completely. You're also still making assumptions. It makes no difference that he couldn't get rid of his feelings and we already know he has them. Having such feelings does not automatically mean something would happen. You have to DO something to make it happen and Pacey didn't go to Aunt Gwen's with the intention of making anything happen between himself and Joey. He wasn't expecting it. If he wasn't expecting it then he can't have been planning it, feelings or not! He only went to be near her! That is why he said 'proximity is a good thing,' It meant he could be near her even if she didn't feel the same way, even if he knew nothing could happen. And nothing could happen - unless Joey wanted it to and gave him some indication that she did and as far as he knew she didn't.



If Joey hadn't gone there is the possibility that he wouldn't have either, but it's just as likely that he would have done considering that he had Will to entertain. So I think it's more likely he would have gone.

hshapir2

word. Pacey just wanted to be near her. He did not expect anything. It was her choice for how she wanted things to develop with him like he said in another episode. When she tells him he made her feel alive, then he said he had to kiss her. He said if she didn't want him to, then she would have to stop him. She chose not to, so it was her choice

COOLCAT200

Jaycee I think you forgot but you already posted all of that. It's on page 9

marjoster

i love this epi it's so great!!!!

nessa24

hey,
since this is a season 3 eppy, where did pacey live in season 3 before he went to dougs? I know he mentioned that he left home because his sister came back with the kids but in the thanksgiving eppy he mentions how he was going to his parents house? Also, on that subject, did jen live with grams in season 5 and 6? did jack move back into grams after he got kicked out of the frat? why did he get kicked out? what happened with him and his frat friend that he dated? where did dawson live during season 5 and 6? Did they mention Jack's dad even though they didn't show him? Did they ever mention Joey's dad after he got out of jail in season 5 until merry mayhem? Didn't they mention that Audrey was a **** in season five and slept around but then changed it? what did she and that eliot guy do? after jack got hurt and couldn't play football again, did he mention football again? how come gail told mitch about the affair? in escape from witch island were there really ghosts? were the boat guy and the other lady the ghosts? Thanks for all the help!!!

Juli236

This Is By Far My Absolut Favourite Episode Of Dc!!!!!!!!!!! I Love It More And More Every Day It Pasts....

Trebuchette

This is so crazy to be back like, 20 years later LOL. I found a YT with the original music (!!!) of DC scenes, and that set me on a HUGE S3 binge. I liked Joey best right about this episode. Boy I wish they hadn't blown the the original scores (get that contract!!!). And maybe I wish I hadn't trashed my dvds after "DC: the college years" too, but notes:

• Joey and Pacey running around kissing in this episode was cute. All the stories were just freakin cute in this era.

• I'm glad they put JJ front-and-center because he can act!

• So I haven't watched this since, well back when Joey's hair went frizzy (college years? 2002 I guess?) and imo they made Joey a Mary Sue after high school. That's why I quit back then.

• This episode is probably the "cutest" of Joey, but also the pinnacle of her character since she spent the rest of S3 acting like a "Dawson bot" and dragging her misery everywhere, then got sold as DC's Mary Sue (could do no wrong).

• The writers were clearly trying to make Dawson the angry psychopath after Longest Day —but looking back, I think it worked for the series! Shows don't tend to do that anymore, making leads "tarnished" like they did to Dawson. Also:

• Anything after S4 or so, I can't comment on, but another positive of this show I didn't appreciate at the time was that, lead characters could screw up royally, and suffer consequences, and while some stories and arcs seemed a bit hamfisted at the time, current year producers/writers really don't like protagonists getting ANYWHERE NEAR "screwed up royally" unless it's for laughs.

These characters are a bit unapologetic, like, yeah, these 16yos fall in love and they should "do the right thing" but ...16 year olds! And at least in S3 (S2 if I recall, as well), they KNEW they were in the wrong, and they didn't know the right answers, and that has been actually refreshing to watch today.

They can't write this stuff anymore. It's probably illegal, I guess, to suggest that a girl might fall in love with soulmate's BFF and not be able to make a perfect decision because she actually cares about everyone involved.

But I had a fun day watching S3 and will probably do S2 soon. I don't think there's an episode in S2 I liked more than this one (which tbh surprises me but, yep, this was just awesome TV! Hour not wasted!)

Butterfly85

I didn't know SK had it's own thread, but since it looks like the last posts were from 15 years ago (DAMN!!!) No wonder. As I said many times, I freaking love this episode and it's my favorite of S3. I love all the sexual tension with Pacey and Joey in the episode. Them fighting over the bed and covers, Pacey waking up and just staring at Joey, Joey telling Pacey he made her feel alive and the ten kiss, and their final scene where they really talk about their feelings and Joey kisses Pacey. I still love this episode a lot 20 years later. I can't believe it's been that long. I remember I was on spring break in high school when this episode aired and I was so happy and giddy P/J finally got together.

Forwood4Bamon

This episode I liked.

AbbieJean

I love Stolen Kisses. It is one of my favorite Pacey/Joey episodes. Pacey is so adorable pining after Joey. I cheered when she finally admits that she has feelings for Pacey. And those kisses... Whew! Heart stopping chemistry.

The funny thing is that the writers didn't intend us to view Dawson an angry possessive psychopath. He is supposed to be Arthur fighting for Lancelot for Guinevere's love. The two women who wrote "Show Me Love" which portrayed Dawson at his worse were huge Dawson/Joey fans. It never occurs to the writers that Dawson should not almost kill Pacey and Will in the regatta or even apologize for almost killing them. Notice that Dawson never apologizes to Pacey or Joey for his horrific behavior in those episodes. In the season 3 finale, when he gives that ridiculous speech telling Joey to go to Pacey, he is supposed to come off as the wounded, but self-sacrificing hero although he is really just a self-absorbed possessive ass.

I do think that when the writers saw the intense negative reaction to Dawson after the season 3 finale, they made a conscious effort to redeem him by writing him as the wounded jilted, but forgiving lover throughout season 4 while playing up Pacey's insecurities and having him yell at Joey at the prom so they could pivot back to the Dawson/Joey relationship as they had always intended. The only thing that surprised me and still does now is that the writers allowed Joey to lose her virginity to Pacey and not wait to lose it with Dawson.

JJH85

This is my favourite episode too which is why I wrote a Fan Fic of the scene where they are in bed together.

This is also the episode where I really realized how amazing a kisser Josh must be. You are right about that kissing scene

Butterfly85

What, I never knew the people that wrote Dawson as such a huge asswipe in "Show Me Love" were Dawson/Joey fans. That was the MAIN episode that made me HATE Dawson. I'm surprised it was D/J fan writers that made him such a huge ahole in the episode lmao. At the time, I was pleasantly surprised they wrote Joey to lose her virginity to Pacey too but I am glad they did. Especially when they had a very serious, adult relationship and it was the most serious relationship for both of them. They made the right choice, just like when they had Pacey and Joey end up together.

I agree that Stolen Kisses really shows what a great kisser Pacey is (same for The Longest Day) I'm still shook by the way Pacey kisses Joey when he says "ten," it's so damn hot and sensual! I'm still pissed Gwen interrupted that kiss. Pacey never kissed Andie that way, and of course Joey never kissed Dawson or another guy the way she kissed Pacey. No moaning with the other guys either lol.

AbbieJean

Gawd, the moaning... You know she was feeling it. Honestly, until that scene in The Longest Day, I never saw Joey as anything more than the girl next door. When she was moaning and running her hands through Pacey's hair, I swear my mouth dropped open. Katie Holmes actually convincingly portrayed Joey as a woman in love full of love and desire. Wow. The show wasted their chemistry keeping them apart.

Butterfly85

Me too, cause I never saw Joey like that before. She was so fierce and into kissing Pacey, she couldn't keep her hands off him lol. I guess it would make sense for Joey to moan, no one kissed her like that till Pacey entered the picture. Joey was always ready to pounce Pacey like a hungry cheetah.

msstock87

Their was always something about their kisses. So passionate.

I love this episode so much. I just re watched it recently.