Fan Forum - View Single Post - Topic of the Week #14: Murder in the Family

**sunnykerr** · 07-31-2008, 10:46 AM

I don't think anyone on this thread has, at any point, come anywhere near to saying that we should respect murderers, whether they do it in the so-called name of family honour or else.

In fact, I do believe my own words were that these criminals should in no way be exempt from the law.

There is no respect to be given to men who commit this crime.

My only concern has been for our ability to reach the wouldbe victim before her death. And all I've ever said about that is that I think it would be easier to reach anyone if we approach them with respect for their cultural values.

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It has plenty to do with people using culture as an excuse not to condemn honor killings and to do nothing about them. Do you know that someone here on FF said that if people are in their own country and following their country's tradition then maybe honor killing should be allowed? ALLOWED! Murdering your daughter for honor, allowed.

Truthfully, I have no recollection of anyone saying on

that honour killings should be allowed.

Obviously, that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

But, as such a preposterous concept has yet to be brought up on this thread... perhaps we'd do better to debate what we're actually debating now as opposed to what was once the subject of debate.

If you feel that someone is using culture to support honour killings on this thread, feel free to debate them on that,

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Since when did I say anything about lumping a whole culture in with honor killing? I said absolutely NOTHING that had anything to do with lumping a whole cullture in with anything negative. Please don't put words in my mouth.

I'm sorry you felt personally targetted by my comments. That was in no way my intention. It's true that was bouncing off the idea that a discussion of culture in this context was nonsense, but it's quite clearly possible that I read that as something different than the meaning intended.

In any case, I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth. In fact, I was using the word "you" in a general matter; like how we say "you can't make an omelet without breaking eggs." I wasn't trying to say that you were doing any lumping any more than I've just implied that you're currently baking an omelet.

Or, you know, I was using the word "you" in the same way you did when you said, You don't "respect" a practice like honor killing or honor it with the name "culture", you just move against it same as you would against any other seriously disturbing criminal practice.

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People use the "culture" thing as a reason to do nothing and avoid condemning the practice. That is dangerously misguided and damaging and costs LIVES.

I think that people have a better chance of doing something about it, something that will have actual results, if they come from a place of culutral understanding and toleration. I don't see how information is the death of action in this case.

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The issue with honor killing isn't culture, the issue is a horrible crime. Honor killing should not be respected by being given the label of culture. It should not be treated as a legitimate part of any culture. It's just an obscene aberration. You don't "respect" a practice like honor killing or honor it with the name "culture", you just move against it same as you would against any other seriously disturbing criminal practice.

I don't think that saying that certain crimes have a cultural element to them is any sign of disrespect. If anything, wouldn't calling them "honour killings" have already committed that sin of given them this alleged respect?

If we're already recognizing the fact that there are different cases of spousal murder, I don't see the big problem with recognizing that that difference lies in the differences of culture. Because, yeah, so-called honour killings happen in a variety of different communitiies, but they're not appearing across the globe either, are they? Show me the WASP who kills his daughter for wanting to marry a non-WASP or for failing to provide her husband with a son, and I'll agree that this has nothing to do with culture.

Till then, I still think that trying to understand an abbheration and a hateful crime does in no way mean that I respect it or the criminals who commit it.

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To even mention respect with reference to honor killings is obscene.

Agreed. But I don't think anyone here's done that, have they? Have I?

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People can be left to the mercies of honor killers because the authorities want to to "respect the cultural element involved".

Once again, agreed.

I just think that police can also alienate the people who need rescuing by failing to respect their cultural values.

Again, don't give a darn about the criminals. Just trying to help the wouldbe victims.